Stop Chasing Realtors: Build a Referral Machine That Scales

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What if the reason you're struggling to get consistent referrals isn't because you need more coffee meetings, more cold calls, or more follow-up?

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What if the real problem is that you don't have a system that keeps attracting agents, building trust, and creating opportunities without starting from zero every week?

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You're listening to the Mortgage Marketing Radio Podcast, where we help mortgage professionals build relationships, get referrals, and grow a more predictable mortgage business.

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My name is Jeff Zimpfer.

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I'm your host.

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And today we're breaking down how to stop chasing realtors one at a time and start building a referral machine that can actually scale.

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My guest is Logan Lindstrom.

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After stepping away from mortgage for roughly two years, Logan returned to the business, became a broker, and has rapidly built his production to 136 units and more than 40 million in volume year to date.

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90% roughly of his business is coming from realtors.

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And the strategy behind that growth is what makes this conversation so timely.

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Logan is building a workshop-driven realtor acquisition system designed to move beyond the occasional lunch and learn.

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He's scaling toward multiple workshops every week, combining in-person events with live streaming, outbound prospecting, paid ads, retargeting, testimonials, and systematic follow-up.

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In this episode, you'll learn how Logan turns educational workshops into a repeatable realtor referral funnel, why he teaches marketing, AI, sales, and technology instead of leading with mortgage content, and how he's simplifying his business so he can handle more volume without adding unnecessary complexity.

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And pay close attention to what Logan says about what happens after you meet the realtor, because getting the meeting may not be your biggest problem.

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If you're tired of constantly chasing the next referral partner and you want to build a system that creates leverage, relationships, and repeatable opportunities, stick around for this episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio.

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Logan, welcome to the show.

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Hi, Jeff.

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Thanks for having me.

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Thanks for jumping in on short notice.

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So to set this up,

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I was having a conversation with your account rep at Rocket, Jeff.

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So I'm talking to Jeff about aging classes and he goes, hey, you should talk to Logan because Logan just gave this presentation at the Rocket event called the Rocket Pro Experience where you were, how many brokers, you know, originators were in the room there, like 500 or something?

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There was like 500, 700 in person.

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And I think they had like...

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crazy amount, like thousands online.

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I don't know the phone number.

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So that's an event that, right, that's an event that Rocket puts on for their brokers to come on in and see what's happening the latest, but also educate them, bring in people like you who are doing cool things.

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And so when Jeff said that, he said your presentation crushed it, people were really, really leaning in and curious to hear more, so that's why you're here, man.

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So let's just give the context.

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You were a retail originator.

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You got out of the business for a couple of years, but you just started back up roughly two years ago as a broker.

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Did you start two years ago?

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Yeah, yeah.

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Last April of 2025, I got my broker's license here in Wisconsin, which is where I'm from.

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So...

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Yeah, before that, I was never in the broker space.

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Got it.

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Okay.

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So essentially, you had a break.

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You had a hiatus from even originating for a period of time.

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So you started over.

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Yeah, pretty much.

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I mean, there were still a few relationships that obviously people recognize me.

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And I had the knowledge of how to put together a loan.

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So I wasn't like a brand new start.

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I knew what had to happen.

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But more so, I learned a lot more business stuff in those two years I was gone, which definitely helps on the broker side.

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Okay.

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And you also relocated or you went back to where you're originally from in, where is it?

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Is it Milwaukee or where you're at?

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Yeah, Milwaukee.

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So home, born and raised here.

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And then I moved to Charlotte, North Carolina, which is a beautiful place.

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Lived there for about a year and a half and moved back to Milwaukee, which obviously is where I have a lot of my relationships.

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So that definitely helped when you're starting new.

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Yeah.

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All right.

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So, and you moved back to Milwaukee when?

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March, March of this year.

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March of this year.

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Wow.

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Not that long.

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Okay.

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And you were, yeah, you were sharing with me before we hit record that you're now on pace.

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You've now that you've been able to ramp up or whatnot year to date.

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And this is where are we?

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September 10th, 136 units so far this year, right?

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Yes.

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Yep.

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Just over 40 million in volume.

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Yeah.

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Congratulations, man.

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What is your number one source of business?

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Realtors.

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Realtors.

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Okay.

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And pretty much, I'd say 90% realtors, 10% accountants and financial advisors.

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So yeah, realtors are the bread and butter right now.

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Okay.

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And how do you feel about that, by the way?

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You know, it's heavily weighted in realtors.

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Just curious.

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Yeah.

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I used to not like it.

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And I know there's a lot of people that don't like it, but I turned, I'm shifting the mindset from like, you know, you build your top 10 relationships and like those are the people you focus on to creating a machine and a system of how to acquire new realtors, keep them in and retain them as long as possible.

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And naturally there's going to be people that churn out, but that's why you have the system.

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And if I just, you focus on that system to always be getting new ones, then that's kind of the, that's the reoccurring thing.

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So that's, yeah, that's how I'm looking at it.

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So when you, yeah, we're going to definitely unpack that.

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I love the word that you use, machine, acquiring, because I think, I'd love to hear your take on that.

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I think part of the frustration with a lot of originators is that they don't have a replicable system for attracting, acquiring, and converting realtors to become referral partners.

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A lot of them do the one-off, chasing, cold calling, whatever, go to coffee, all that stuff.

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And you lead with teaching classes and workshops, right?

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Yeah.

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And I still do those things because all those things that you just listed, I look at that as that's all top funnel.

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So that's like driving them into the system.

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Right.

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But it's where most people don't have.

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And I didn't have for four years in the business was like, okay, when we're doing the coffees, doing the cold calling, we're doing all that stuff.

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What, what's that?

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What are the mechanisms that keep them in?

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And that's kind of what we focus on.

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So I would look at the workshop is like, that's that machine.

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Right.

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and just one of the examples.

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So I still do all that because that's like important and it works.

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Yeah, but you know, that's actually, it's an interesting angle is I've never heard anybody characterize it like that is you're still doing all of all the kind of onesie, twosie, one-to-one coffee, whatever things, yet you pointed out something I think is, it's very important.

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It's,

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What do you do with them after that meeting, that lunch?

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Most people let that relationship just unravel.

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There's no specific course of action after that.

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For you, the events and classes are like the next, is that middle of funnel for you, classes?

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Classes?

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Yep.

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Yeah.

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Because it's something that's repeatable that they can keep coming back to.

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And it's just a lot of stuff that I can keep them engaged with.

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That's not just, hey, how was your weekend?

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So I imagine though, you also meet agents, they become top of the funnel because they came to your class first or no?

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They can.

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That's one way.

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So like if I'm running, if we, you know, launch paid ads and they're coming right from a paid ad, or if I'm cold calling specifically asking to come to a workshop, then yeah.

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But like, you know, there's there's listing agents, right?

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There's people who come and they're not represented.

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And I meet buyers that way.

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So there's a lot of different ways.

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Or like, if I just want to meet with people, I can still reach out and say, hey, let's get together.

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Let's go for drinks or something like that.

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All that would be considered top funnel.

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Well, let's do it like this.

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Let's run the playbook.

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I don't know if you have this visually mapped out for yourself somewhere, but map it out for me.

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Do you have a target, by the way, of realtors you want on your bus, and do you rank them ABC by production?

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Give me a little insight there.

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So I'm in the process of changing all of this.

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So yes, we all, I had filtered out realtors local here in my market that I want to build a relationship with.

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But I realized that I just need to be doing so much more, like just more of everything, more output, more workshops, more meetings, all of that.

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So I brought in that search and I basically, I basically was trying to think of ways to make it easier for more realtors to say yes to what I was selling.

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Right.

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I expanded the list to statewide because I I'm licensed a couple of states, but I'm, I'm like, okay, to hit my goals, I really just need to focus in on a very narrow market.

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Right.

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Because it's like, I don't, I, yeah, I could go focus on getting deals down in Florida, but like, why?

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Like, like I can get to a hundred loans a month, which is my goal right now, just in, in Wisconsin.

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Like it happens all the time.

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So I opened it up to Wisconsin.

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I filtered buyer agents that do more than four buy sides a year.

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I know some people do more, but again, I'm trying to just capture a wider net and I exported it from Rudder and now that's our target list.

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I run workshops in person and I'm about to start actually live streaming them all.

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So obviously because I'm pulling a list from the whole state, I need to be able to let them come in and they're not gonna drive to my office to come to a workshop.

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So, but they can join a webinar

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And it's like to market to that many more agents, it's such a small lift in actual cost and what it takes to do that.

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It's like, why not?

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Right.

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It's that's an example of how do I make it easier for more people to say yes to what I'm selling and offering.

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OK, go ahead.

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OK, so that is your main machine then is in terms of acquiring, I'll say at scale, if you agree with that, acquiring agents at scale.

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Do you would you say that's a fair way to describe it?

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Yep.

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And I was for this year, I was doing them in real estate offices and wherever I could find a space.

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And then I realized like in effort to just do so much more volume, I just I'm bringing it in house, like literally as we speak.

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So my workshops are now going to be either come to my office or you just got to go online because it was taking too much effort to go find a place, deal with the facilitation, set up, take down, arrange food or snacks or whatever the hell I'm going to do.

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Like it just was too much.

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So by bringing it literally like behind this curtains, like a big side of my office, I get the table set up like I can fit, you know, eight to 12 people, which is all you need in person in here.

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And starting Wednesday, I'm doing six workshops a week.

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So Monday, Wednesdays and Fridays, one hour sessions.

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But it's like I'm here like I literally just can can do my business stuff here.

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And then when people come up, I post them.

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give a presentation and done.

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Then I'm good until the next one.

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So it's like, it's more scalable.

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We can have way more opportunities for people to come and engage with us.

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And hopefully that yield better returns.

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So I'll keep you posted on that.

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Yeah, six to eight a week.

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That's a lot.

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That's a lot.

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It makes me think, I was just on a call earlier today with a handful of loan officers.

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And one of the questions this guy asked was his concern about saturating the market because he was doing like three events over three months or something like that, right?

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Yeah.

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and that just blows that out of the water.

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I mean, you're in Milwaukee, which is, you know, I mean, it's not LA.

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There's half a million people.

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How many realtors?

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3,000, 4,000?

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I've never met somebody that could actually saturate a market.

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Yeah, right, I know.

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Okay.

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Now, how are you?

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Getting, we'll get to content in a minute, but what is your process for getting agents to attend, show up, how do you, you've got your list, you said your criteria, four units a year, so what is your process for getting them to show up?

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Got a question for ya.

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Are you still trying to win over agents one coffee meeting or call at a time?

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There's a better way.

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Teach a class.

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One room of 20 agents beats 20 cold calls and 20 coffee meetings.

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That's how Glenda White closed $2 million in loans in a single month, all referred by agents who came to her classes.

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Never taught a class?

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Already teaching but struggling to fill the room where you're not sure what topics agents will actually show up for?

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This is for you too.

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My free five-day email course is

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The agent class method shows you how to pick the topics agents want, how to fill the seats with the right agents, and turn that room into referral conversations.

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You can get it free at myagentclasses.com forward slash email course, or check the link in the show notes.

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Once again, that's myagentclasses.com forward slash email course.

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Like once they confirm that they're coming?

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I mean, no.

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The first invite outbound, how are you getting people to make reservations?

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Do you send email, DMs, call?

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So, so far I've done a lot of emails and calling and texts.

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That's been the main thing.

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I hired a full-time marketing guy recently, which is going to allow us to start doing DMs.

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It's going to allow us to start doing, I'm running paid ads now.

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I'm putting a relatively healthy budget behind it.

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That'll just get in front of everybody, that entire list.

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And then just a lot of that.

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Okay.

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So email, email.

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So a fair amount of the people you're emailing are cold emails.

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Is that correct?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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How does that go?

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And are you using, by the way, I'm really curious.

222
00:12:18.192 --> 00:12:21.275
I want to get granular on this for a minute because this is a lot of what I do in my world.

223
00:12:21.855 --> 00:12:22.055
Yeah.

224
00:12:22.396 --> 00:12:23.677
Are you using Outlook for that?

225
00:12:23.697 --> 00:12:25.698
Are you using a third-party email platform?

226
00:12:26.078 --> 00:12:27.099
Yeah.

227
00:12:27.440 --> 00:12:29.942
I should have been using some type of email platform.

228
00:12:30.802 --> 00:12:36.285
I wasn't to be like, and that's something that we're going to be changing now because of the magnitude of what we're trying to do here now.

229
00:12:36.626 --> 00:12:41.648
I was literally like, I was using Claude to basically put drafts in my email.

230
00:12:42.029 --> 00:12:45.090
And then I had to go into Gmail and manually send all the drafts.

231
00:12:45.150 --> 00:12:46.051
It took a long time.

232
00:12:46.331 --> 00:12:50.572
But like, again, like it's one of those things where it's like, we know there's email platforms out there.

233
00:12:50.592 --> 00:12:51.192
We know all this stuff.

234
00:12:51.212 --> 00:12:54.433
But then I go down that hole and it's like, okay, well, you don't want to break a domain.

235
00:12:54.473 --> 00:12:56.654
You got to warm the internet, man, but you don't want to get spam.

236
00:12:56.674 --> 00:12:57.694
Like there's all this shit.

237
00:12:57.714 --> 00:13:00.155
I'm like, I just needed, I just need the emails to get delivered.

238
00:13:00.515 --> 00:13:04.036
So I was manually doing so much of it, which works, but like you need a lot.

239
00:13:04.076 --> 00:13:07.397
Like I'd sent 800 emails and you had 18 people to show up.

240
00:13:08.066 --> 00:13:08.266
Yeah.

241
00:13:08.846 --> 00:13:09.146
Okay.

242
00:13:09.346 --> 00:13:09.826
That's right.

243
00:13:09.887 --> 00:13:12.867
The realtors, you need to do so much more to get a result.

244
00:13:13.067 --> 00:13:13.307
Right.

245
00:13:13.347 --> 00:13:16.448
Which is why you're laying on these additional things such as the ads you just mentioned.

246
00:13:16.708 --> 00:13:17.569
So obviously you would agree.

247
00:13:17.589 --> 00:13:20.829
And I, and I, it depends on like what your goal is though.

248
00:13:20.849 --> 00:13:29.392
Like if, if all you're looking to do is fill an event once a month with 20 agents, you could do that in your own email, Gmail client.

249
00:13:29.952 --> 00:13:30.472
Absolutely.

250
00:13:30.852 --> 00:13:31.632
That's what I've been doing.

251
00:13:31.932 --> 00:13:32.173
Yeah.

252
00:13:32.473 --> 00:13:33.253
I mean, totally.

253
00:13:33.273 --> 00:13:33.593
No worries.

254
00:13:34.285 --> 00:13:40.089
It's actually easier than dealing with all the headaches you mentioned, which I know too well, of ISP issues and all that.

255
00:13:40.389 --> 00:13:42.390
Yep.

256
00:13:42.871 --> 00:13:45.793
Okay, so let's talk about the ads for a minute because I'm curious about that.

257
00:13:45.993 --> 00:13:49.835
What types of topics are you typically teaching for these agents?

258
00:13:50.176 --> 00:13:52.297
You said talk about ads or like the content?

259
00:13:52.617 --> 00:13:58.321
Well, I'm making a side entrance into ads because I have a certain belief about getting butts in seats.

260
00:13:58.681 --> 00:14:03.505
And in my experience, here's a rule I live by, and I'd love for you to jam on this, is...

261
00:14:04.145 --> 00:14:12.508
The number, my rule, my saying is the number one way, the number one thing that gets agents to show up for your class or not is the title.

262
00:14:12.528 --> 00:14:13.328
How do you feel about that?

263
00:14:13.368 --> 00:14:14.468
What's your reaction to that?

264
00:14:14.648 --> 00:14:14.948
I agree.

265
00:14:15.188 --> 00:14:16.969
And by the way, none of this is prepared.

266
00:14:17.009 --> 00:14:19.430
You and I just met like 10 minutes ago.

267
00:14:19.530 --> 00:14:20.210
Yeah, yeah.

268
00:14:21.110 --> 00:14:21.850
I agree.

269
00:14:22.010 --> 00:14:25.071
I think it's creative, which is a part of what they're seeing.

270
00:14:25.191 --> 00:14:26.671
So yeah, what they first can take.

271
00:14:26.951 --> 00:14:27.812
And then also proof.

272
00:14:28.152 --> 00:14:40.235
That's something that I was never, literally until I got up on stage and rock it and went through that whole experience at RPX, I literally felt like I was not doing enough that my business sucked and that I was all behind.

273
00:14:40.495 --> 00:14:42.855
And it wasn't until that group of people kind of broke that mindset.

274
00:14:43.155 --> 00:14:50.257
And I realized I need to just tell more people about what I do because there's people who will get value from that and who want to learn that.

275
00:14:50.617 --> 00:14:58.299
And it was like a light switch going off in my head because it's like, okay, even though I'm not where I want to be, there's still people who would, who want to try to get to this point.

276
00:14:58.579 --> 00:15:04.441
And I can use these things that I love to talk about already, which is marketing sales conversions and like help through that.

277
00:15:04.841 --> 00:15:07.161
So that's, yeah, that's what I started doing.

278
00:15:07.201 --> 00:15:08.642
But that ties into the creative, right?

279
00:15:08.662 --> 00:15:12.483
Because it's like, okay, how do, why do people, why would somebody want to show up?

280
00:15:12.603 --> 00:15:14.263
Well, they need to trust you.

281
00:15:14.303 --> 00:15:18.144
You need to prove to them that what you're, what they may or may not learn could actually work to them.

282
00:15:18.664 --> 00:15:24.948
And you need to create something that's visually appealing to get them to stop what they're doing to read your average.

283
00:15:25.048 --> 00:15:26.009
So talk to me about proof.

284
00:15:26.069 --> 00:15:28.270
How do you handle proof ahead of time?

285
00:15:28.490 --> 00:15:34.734
So I did a workshop once where I got nine of the realtors to leave me video testimonials.

286
00:15:35.095 --> 00:15:41.999
And I had them state who they're with, how long they've been in business, who they're with, what was their biggest takeaway, and if they'd recommend the workshop to another person.

287
00:15:43.370 --> 00:15:49.115
I turned that into like 20 video ads, and now I can run all those, and that's like proof.

288
00:15:49.395 --> 00:15:49.836
Interesting.

289
00:15:49.996 --> 00:15:51.957
Okay, so that's part of your ad creative is those proofs.

290
00:15:51.977 --> 00:15:52.478
That's part of it.

291
00:15:52.758 --> 00:15:52.998
Yep.

292
00:15:53.439 --> 00:16:00.905
And what I'm doing here in my in-person workshops now is every workshop, there's people here, I try to get video testimonials.

293
00:16:01.125 --> 00:16:01.325
Right.

294
00:16:01.405 --> 00:16:06.027
So really like the hardest part with this concept, in my opinion, would be getting it going.

295
00:16:06.047 --> 00:16:06.227
Right.

296
00:16:06.247 --> 00:16:14.491
But as soon as you can start getting people here, as long as you're actually maximizing the opportunities of getting stuff like video testimonials, you create that self-licking ice cream cone.

297
00:16:14.851 --> 00:16:15.031
Right.

298
00:16:15.071 --> 00:16:17.592
Because every if I'm doing these every three days.

299
00:16:17.712 --> 00:16:17.912
Right.

300
00:16:18.012 --> 00:16:26.456
I have every other day new, fresh, creative content that we can put back into meta or wherever we're distributing ads and content like it just takes care of itself.

301
00:16:26.596 --> 00:16:26.776
Yeah.

302
00:16:27.116 --> 00:16:27.776
I love the video.

303
00:16:27.796 --> 00:16:29.317
That's like the ultimate, if you can get that.

304
00:16:29.677 --> 00:16:32.697
And the fallback is if you can just get a written testimonial, right?

305
00:16:32.717 --> 00:16:34.838
That's equally usable as well.

306
00:16:35.798 --> 00:16:40.119
I liked, I liked video and like get, if you can get producers there.

307
00:16:40.459 --> 00:16:43.340
And that's the reason why I had them say how long they've been in business.

308
00:16:43.420 --> 00:16:52.642
Because especially with meta right now, like if you run something and it says like 10 plus years in business, like actually on the text and the videos in between meta will put that in front of those people.

309
00:16:53.022 --> 00:16:53.222
Right.

310
00:16:53.242 --> 00:16:54.362
Like that's, that's the whole.

311
00:16:54.983 --> 00:16:56.603
It'll put that in front of seasoned agents.

312
00:16:57.243 --> 00:16:58.044
Yeah, correct.

313
00:16:58.144 --> 00:17:06.491
So I really, I really wanted to get like the people I wanted to, I wanted to get avatars or types of realtors that I also wanted to keep working with on the camera.

314
00:17:06.511 --> 00:17:07.892
Yeah, no, that's very smart.

315
00:17:08.252 --> 00:17:08.452
Yeah.

316
00:17:08.472 --> 00:17:09.873
The algorithm is so smart these days.

317
00:17:09.913 --> 00:17:12.155
It'll recognize, oh, he's looking for senior people.

318
00:17:12.495 --> 00:17:12.776
Wow.

319
00:17:13.076 --> 00:17:13.456
That's cool.

320
00:17:13.736 --> 00:17:13.936
All right.

321
00:17:13.956 --> 00:17:15.237
Let's get into some of the topics then.

322
00:17:15.278 --> 00:17:18.120
What have been some of your best or most well-attended topics?

323
00:17:18.885 --> 00:17:21.047
Marketing, a lot of marketing related AI.

324
00:17:21.067 --> 00:17:22.989
I use a lot of AI in my business.

325
00:17:23.230 --> 00:17:27.294
So just breaking down tools and actually teaching realtors how to use it.

326
00:17:27.674 --> 00:17:35.022
Like you run a Claude session and you teach them how to turn Claude into like a tool that can take their listing contracts and put it into a presentation for their sellers.

327
00:17:35.382 --> 00:17:35.582
Right.

328
00:17:35.922 --> 00:17:38.364
I had Claude create me a prompt to give them.

329
00:17:38.464 --> 00:17:39.585
And then I just presented it.

330
00:17:39.965 --> 00:17:41.346
They brought their laptops and they did it.

331
00:17:41.546 --> 00:17:49.030
And like that was a really popular session because people just actually did something during the class that they they could see work for themselves.

332
00:17:49.110 --> 00:17:49.330
Yeah.

333
00:17:50.111 --> 00:17:52.352
And like so but in AI is always changing, too.

334
00:17:52.532 --> 00:17:53.713
And it's I use in my business.

335
00:17:53.753 --> 00:18:00.737
So I try to keep the topics and what I talk about things that I generally enjoy doing because it's the easiest for me to then create and talk about.

336
00:18:01.177 --> 00:18:02.000
You know what I mean?

337
00:18:02.020 --> 00:18:05.210
Like most of my content, I don't talk about mortgage stuff.

338
00:18:05.792 --> 00:18:05.992
Right.

339
00:18:06.152 --> 00:18:07.753
It's not my favorite part of the business.

340
00:18:07.793 --> 00:18:10.555
Like, it's just not like I know it because that's what we do.

341
00:18:10.595 --> 00:18:13.117
But I like the whole marketing and sales side of it.

342
00:18:13.217 --> 00:18:16.539
And that goes back to kind of what we're saying earlier about the title of your classes.

343
00:18:16.759 --> 00:18:24.103
From my experience is the mortgage related ones, although there's a time and a place for them, they aren't your most popular classes.

344
00:18:24.364 --> 00:18:24.564
Right.

345
00:18:24.784 --> 00:18:25.444
Well, exactly.

346
00:18:25.624 --> 00:18:31.708
And in a market, like if there's other people doing workshops, which there's not a there most likely isn't a ton.

347
00:18:32.108 --> 00:18:32.809
That's what they're doing.

348
00:18:33.540 --> 00:18:34.000
Yeah, right.

349
00:18:34.020 --> 00:18:35.441
They're doing a mortgage 101.

350
00:18:35.781 --> 00:18:37.302
Don't compete with them on that.

351
00:18:37.402 --> 00:18:41.465
Just do something that is not even relevant to what they're teaching.

352
00:18:41.485 --> 00:18:53.772
Do you ever, I'm curious, do you ever run into the agent who doesn't, quote, recognize you as a loan officer, but sees you as like, oh, this digital marketer guy taught me how to do this.

353
00:18:54.233 --> 00:18:55.533
They haven't connected the dots.

354
00:18:55.594 --> 00:19:02.818
And do you have to help them connect the dots of like, no, one of the reasons I do this is I hope to become a partner and earn your business.

355
00:19:03.038 --> 00:19:11.721
So I set the stage at the beginning of the events and I basically say, if by the end of the session, you feel that I delivered on high value content that you benefit from.

356
00:19:11.921 --> 00:19:16.682
If I only if I do that, you guys give me two minutes to give you an elevator pitch on my mortgage company.

357
00:19:17.063 --> 00:19:17.683
End of the session.

358
00:19:17.743 --> 00:19:19.263
Hey, guys, how did everything go to everything?

359
00:19:19.343 --> 00:19:20.884
Everybody take good value from this?

360
00:19:21.224 --> 00:19:21.424
Yes.

361
00:19:21.484 --> 00:19:21.724
All right.

362
00:19:21.764 --> 00:19:24.645
Is it OK now if I give you two minutes feel on my mortgage business?

363
00:19:25.005 --> 00:19:25.768
Rock into it.

364
00:19:25.808 --> 00:19:28.254
12 day closings, quick speed, like you just hammer it.

365
00:19:28.475 --> 00:19:28.936
And that's it.

366
00:19:29.117 --> 00:19:31.303
People don't need to get like bogged down by what you do.

367
00:19:31.323 --> 00:19:33.268
Like they, people know how mortgage companies operate.

368
00:19:34.485 --> 00:19:35.525
So we do that in person.

369
00:19:35.585 --> 00:19:43.047
And then I also, and anybody, everybody should be doing it because for $5 a day, you can retarget everybody on, on Facebook and Instagram.

370
00:19:43.087 --> 00:19:47.048
So like I run mortgage related ads to these realtors.

371
00:19:47.408 --> 00:19:51.509
So a lot of times, like, even if like they're just coming here and we're just, it's all workshop stuff.

372
00:19:51.529 --> 00:19:54.290
They, they're going to get hit with my, they're on social media.

373
00:19:54.310 --> 00:19:55.810
They're going to get hit with the actual mortgage.

374
00:19:56.110 --> 00:19:59.731
You're taking the class attendees and retargeting them with mortgage ads.

375
00:19:59.751 --> 00:19:59.911
Yeah.

376
00:20:00.747 --> 00:20:00.987
Yeah.

377
00:20:01.588 --> 00:20:01.808
Yeah.

378
00:20:02.268 --> 00:20:07.172
Even before they come though, you can retarget every realtor all the time.

379
00:20:07.192 --> 00:20:07.452
Yeah, yeah.

380
00:20:07.632 --> 00:20:09.954
Are you doing the ads yourself or do you have somebody to help you with that?

381
00:20:10.174 --> 00:20:15.899
I do the creative and then it's 50-50 right now for getting all of the backend stuff set up.

382
00:20:15.919 --> 00:20:21.463
That's why I had to bring in a marketer because I was spending too much time on the backend and I just needed to offload that.

383
00:20:21.563 --> 00:20:29.770
But I like spending time on the creative and then more of like the actual funnel of how a person would go with like a...

384
00:20:29.950 --> 00:20:35.512
a funnel person would go through to get to the workshop, but all the, I'm trying not to do all the technical stuff anymore.

385
00:20:36.592 --> 00:20:36.792
Yeah.

386
00:20:36.952 --> 00:20:38.092
I need to focus on the content.

387
00:20:38.132 --> 00:20:39.132
Like that's the thing too.

388
00:20:39.192 --> 00:20:44.814
I also believe that if you just actually deliver really good session, really good content, people will come back.

389
00:20:44.914 --> 00:20:48.415
It doesn't matter if you screw everything else up, if they actually feel like you're teaching them something,

390
00:20:48.695 --> 00:20:49.296
Yeah, for sure.

391
00:20:49.736 --> 00:20:52.878
Give me a sense of, walk me through a little bit then that funnel from the ads.

392
00:20:52.898 --> 00:20:56.581
Let's say, are you doing a funnel to advertise a class as well?

393
00:20:56.721 --> 00:20:57.142
Say that again.

394
00:20:57.162 --> 00:20:57.702
Am I doing what?

395
00:20:58.183 --> 00:21:00.404
Are you doing a funnel to advertise a class?

396
00:21:01.325 --> 00:21:02.306
I have a funnel.

397
00:21:02.326 --> 00:21:02.506
Yeah.

398
00:21:02.526 --> 00:21:03.567
So I have a domain.

399
00:21:03.587 --> 00:21:04.748
It's called Workshop with Logan.

400
00:21:04.988 --> 00:21:09.471
And that's, we're driving, that's like the top funnel as far as like getting people into there to book.

401
00:21:09.672 --> 00:21:17.758
I didn't, I haven't used, I haven't used this because I, when I was just doing say one event a week, it was, it's so easier, so much easier to track it.

402
00:21:18.078 --> 00:21:26.003
But now that we're going to be doing, you know, two sessions, three days a week, I needed a more robust system for like the actual tracking of that.

403
00:21:26.383 --> 00:21:33.167
So I'm going to just send everybody there and then they can just pick their sessions, book it, and that'll help me keep track.

404
00:21:33.187 --> 00:21:33.948
What do you use for that?

405
00:21:35.253 --> 00:21:38.315
I use a platform called Lovable, lovable.com.

406
00:21:38.355 --> 00:21:39.076
It's like AI.

407
00:21:39.456 --> 00:21:44.059
And I just, it's like you just talk to it and text with it and it'll build what you need.

408
00:21:44.319 --> 00:21:48.342
Is there an example that I could look at at that URL of Workshop with Logan?

409
00:21:48.562 --> 00:21:50.243
Go to workshopwithlogan.com.

410
00:21:50.483 --> 00:21:50.944
And it's there.

411
00:21:51.284 --> 00:21:57.488
The reason why I'm asking is I want to get a sense of, so there are, you have a calendar of events there basically that people can choose from.

412
00:21:57.708 --> 00:21:58.048
Correct.

413
00:21:58.168 --> 00:21:59.049
They drive to the page.

414
00:21:59.750 --> 00:22:05.254
They select which workshop they're going to want to go to, which is either Mondays or markets, mortgage and strategy.

415
00:22:05.554 --> 00:22:07.936
Tuesday or Wednesdays are going to be all marketing and branding.

416
00:22:07.956 --> 00:22:09.817
And then Fridays is going to be sales and technology.

417
00:22:10.098 --> 00:22:10.798
Those are the themes.

418
00:22:11.379 --> 00:22:12.119
And then they can pick.

419
00:22:12.159 --> 00:22:18.284
And then I think they get like three options when they get to the pick a date section where they can choose up to three weeks in advance.

420
00:22:18.444 --> 00:22:19.504
I'm going to screen share this.

421
00:22:20.145 --> 00:22:23.846
Those that are listening, you won't see it, but hey, you can hop over to the YouTube version.

422
00:22:24.566 --> 00:22:25.626
All right.

423
00:22:25.646 --> 00:22:27.307
So here it is right here.

424
00:22:27.347 --> 00:22:28.387
Let me move this out of the way.

425
00:22:28.407 --> 00:22:28.927
All right.

426
00:22:29.607 --> 00:22:31.568
Ready to build a tender workshop with Logan.

427
00:22:31.588 --> 00:22:33.629
There we go.

428
00:22:33.669 --> 00:22:34.769
Choose a workshop.

429
00:22:35.329 --> 00:22:36.770
Let's just take marketing and branding.

430
00:22:37.130 --> 00:22:39.210
And then is this a video promo about the workshop?

431
00:22:39.791 --> 00:22:40.011
Yep.

432
00:22:40.051 --> 00:22:43.592
It's like a 30-second video just explaining what the marketing branding sessions are.

433
00:22:44.132 --> 00:22:46.313
And then that goes to this calendar page.

434
00:22:49.363 --> 00:22:50.504
What about email capture?

435
00:22:50.524 --> 00:22:52.504
It just automatically confirmed me.

436
00:22:54.125 --> 00:22:54.805
That's at the end.

437
00:22:54.865 --> 00:22:55.945
So now you pick the time.

438
00:22:56.586 --> 00:22:57.446
You confirm the date.

439
00:22:58.306 --> 00:23:00.667
Maybe I should change that since I just confused you a little bit.

440
00:23:01.167 --> 00:23:01.708
No, I see.

441
00:23:01.808 --> 00:23:03.368
It's just walking me through step by step.

442
00:23:03.408 --> 00:23:03.988
I see what it is.

443
00:23:04.068 --> 00:23:04.309
Okay.

444
00:23:04.429 --> 00:23:04.729
Got it.

445
00:23:04.749 --> 00:23:04.969
Got it.

446
00:23:04.989 --> 00:23:05.249
Got it.

447
00:23:06.109 --> 00:23:07.150
I'm going to opt in if you don't mind.

448
00:23:07.190 --> 00:23:10.111
I love getting in funnels and seeing what it's all about.

449
00:23:10.131 --> 00:23:10.951
Is that okay?

450
00:23:12.897 --> 00:23:13.318
All right, cool.

451
00:23:13.358 --> 00:23:14.499
No, that's, it was just me.

452
00:23:14.719 --> 00:23:16.041
Like I'm a little bit thick in the head.

453
00:23:16.061 --> 00:23:17.803
I was walking through that.

454
00:23:18.563 --> 00:23:18.784
Wow.

455
00:23:18.804 --> 00:23:20.506
You built all this out on lovable.

456
00:23:21.387 --> 00:23:21.867
Interesting.

457
00:23:21.927 --> 00:23:22.668
I'm going to go back.

458
00:23:22.748 --> 00:23:23.089
Yeah.

459
00:23:23.109 --> 00:23:24.270
This probably took two hours.

460
00:23:24.310 --> 00:23:25.191
Like it's crazy.

461
00:23:25.311 --> 00:23:25.912
The technology.

462
00:23:27.914 --> 00:23:28.295
Yeah.

463
00:23:28.395 --> 00:23:30.157
This is, I'm going to go back to the main page.

464
00:23:32.115 --> 00:23:33.977
And okay, so this is some of your testimonials.

465
00:23:34.357 --> 00:23:37.619
Case in point, we said earlier, these could be written and or video.

466
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:38.460
Nice.

467
00:23:38.500 --> 00:23:39.541
You got more reviews.

468
00:23:40.121 --> 00:23:40.481
Nice.

469
00:23:41.182 --> 00:23:42.323
Are these workshops for you?

470
00:23:42.383 --> 00:23:43.524
Six lessons every week.

471
00:23:45.265 --> 00:23:45.685
Uh-huh.

472
00:23:45.865 --> 00:23:46.826
Nice, nice, nice.

473
00:23:47.647 --> 00:23:47.867
Wow.

474
00:23:47.967 --> 00:23:48.928
Okay, here's the videos.

475
00:23:48.968 --> 00:23:49.188
Yep.

476
00:23:50.589 --> 00:23:51.069
Very cool.

477
00:23:51.610 --> 00:23:51.810
Wow.

478
00:23:53.329 --> 00:23:59.061
All right, and what would you say specific to running Facebook ads related to promoting your events?

479
00:23:59.262 --> 00:24:03.170
Roughly, what is your ad spend for that per month, let's say?

480
00:24:03.778 --> 00:24:09.580
So up until this point, I have not launched, I have not ran ads specifically to getting people to workshop.

481
00:24:09.680 --> 00:24:13.742
I've ran ads retargeting them, but this is a new funnel for my six a week.

482
00:24:14.182 --> 00:24:17.903
So all the retargeting I've been doing, I spend maybe, I don't know, 20 bucks a day.

483
00:24:18.203 --> 00:24:23.205
That's just to retarget them, maybe workshop stuff, but it was never driving them to this funnel.

484
00:24:23.325 --> 00:24:23.465
Yeah.

485
00:24:23.605 --> 00:24:24.786
It's just more of awareness.

486
00:24:24.866 --> 00:24:28.168
And then it helps tie together all my outbound, which is an option.

487
00:24:28.488 --> 00:24:33.030
So like if somebody wanted to do this without having a whole funnel and a system, then they could you could easily do that.

488
00:24:33.131 --> 00:24:37.093
But I'm going to be spending about $100 a day starting probably tonight.

489
00:24:37.293 --> 00:24:38.754
That's just going to be ran on meta.

490
00:24:38.834 --> 00:24:39.834
So we'll see if we'll see.

491
00:24:39.854 --> 00:24:40.875
We'll see what that generates.

492
00:24:41.035 --> 00:24:41.295
Okay.

493
00:24:41.616 --> 00:24:47.722
And give me kind of a dotted line from it's after the event, you've done your pitch at the end.

494
00:24:47.762 --> 00:24:49.504
Hey, did I earn the right to give you a two minute pitch?

495
00:24:49.965 --> 00:24:50.706
You do that.

496
00:24:51.266 --> 00:24:58.394
How does that then move from the butts in seats to a one on one with you to talk about your next buyer or whatever?

497
00:24:58.414 --> 00:25:01.097
How does that look like in the real world?

498
00:25:01.277 --> 00:25:13.300
So within 24 hours after they attend a workshop, they need to be getting a thank you email with a recap of that workshop, along with any assets such as the recording of the video or if I give any deliverables, they'll be attached there.

499
00:25:13.640 --> 00:25:14.600
It'll also invite them.

500
00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:18.701
They'll be able to book their next workshop if they want to say like, hey, thanks for attending marketing and branding.

501
00:25:18.721 --> 00:25:24.722
You want to check out our sales and technology or do you want to attend a Monday mortgage and market combo?

502
00:25:24.763 --> 00:25:24.963
Right.

503
00:25:25.143 --> 00:25:25.923
So that happens.

504
00:25:26.183 --> 00:25:29.164
I call them or somebody on my team calls them, say, hey, thanks for coming.

505
00:25:29.204 --> 00:25:30.384
Just we want to get some feedback.

506
00:25:30.404 --> 00:25:31.044
What's that look like?

507
00:25:31.464 --> 00:25:31.944
Okay, great.

508
00:25:31.964 --> 00:25:38.046
And then if it's somebody who is somebody I want to actually meet with, then that's when we would try to book an in-person meeting.

509
00:25:38.246 --> 00:25:44.269
If not, like if it's somebody who's not like more of like the high, high value avatar I'm going after, then we just can keep inviting them to events.

510
00:25:44.469 --> 00:25:48.210
And then they're automatically on like just marketing for, for these events.

511
00:25:48.530 --> 00:25:50.613
And then that's more of like how we convert the realtor.

512
00:25:51.053 --> 00:25:55.358
And then in that 24 window, there's also, okay, we should have just got more creative.

513
00:25:55.719 --> 00:26:04.269
So let's refresh the ad creative from that workshop on a meta and maybe into the newsletter for trying to capture and keep, keep filling up the sessions.

514
00:26:04.469 --> 00:26:04.789
Got it.

515
00:26:04.869 --> 00:26:07.052
You have a newsletter that goes out just for realtors?

516
00:26:07.312 --> 00:26:07.572
Yeah.

517
00:26:07.672 --> 00:26:10.053
And this will be like new, this will be workshop specific.

518
00:26:10.393 --> 00:26:12.354
I don't have a newsletter and I don't know.

519
00:26:12.414 --> 00:26:13.614
I don't have anything that goes out.

520
00:26:13.654 --> 00:26:16.335
That's like talks about rates or mortgage or markets.

521
00:26:16.495 --> 00:26:18.195
I know like a lot of people do and it's great.

522
00:26:18.235 --> 00:26:19.756
I just, I just, I don't know.

523
00:26:19.816 --> 00:26:26.118
I think a lot of people just, there's so many lenders giving realtors that again, like you're just, you got to separate yourself.

524
00:26:26.378 --> 00:26:26.578
Yeah.

525
00:26:26.898 --> 00:26:36.543
So most of the content, the topics of your classes are things that you're personally working on, learning, experimenting with AI, marketing, that kind of stuff, right?

526
00:26:36.783 --> 00:26:36.963
Yeah.

527
00:26:37.323 --> 00:26:39.164
I'd say, yeah, I mean, pretty much all of it.

528
00:26:39.364 --> 00:26:45.767
Do you find, it's interesting, when I talk to law officers about events, classes, they tell me that the hardest part is coming up with the content.

529
00:26:45.967 --> 00:26:46.948
How do you feel about that?

530
00:26:47.128 --> 00:26:48.089
I think people overthink it.

531
00:26:48.449 --> 00:26:53.974
I think people, if they just look at what they're doing on a daily basis, a lot of that could be considered content and turned into.

532
00:26:54.415 --> 00:27:01.661
Like if you're actively trying to build and build and grow a business, like there's so much stuff that happens and that stuff can be shared.

533
00:27:01.861 --> 00:27:03.823
Like it can be even stuff that doesn't work.

534
00:27:03.863 --> 00:27:10.990
Like it's worth sharing your things that you try to put together, why you did it, what were your thoughts around it, and then tell people what the results were, even if it wasn't good.

535
00:27:11.370 --> 00:27:13.292
Like that could save them time or not doing it.

536
00:27:13.433 --> 00:27:13.653
Right.

537
00:27:13.693 --> 00:27:23.605
So I think there's a lot more content than people realize as simple as you're using a tool in your business to streamline a process, share that with somebody because maybe there's a way that they can use it in their business.

538
00:27:24.012 --> 00:27:24.933
Yeah, that's really, yeah.

539
00:27:25.273 --> 00:27:28.377
And it really goes to your point of like, you know, talking about AI.

540
00:27:28.557 --> 00:27:38.086
I mean, those listening to this, I don't want to get in a whole conversation about using AI or whatnot, because you hopefully are using it to some degree in your business right now in the right way.

541
00:27:38.146 --> 00:27:43.692
Like there are a lot of people I think that are spending unnecessary time doing things in AI that they shouldn't be doing.

542
00:27:44.253 --> 00:27:44.433
Yeah.

543
00:27:45.715 --> 00:27:47.816
That's not necessarily leading to a business outcome.

544
00:27:48.317 --> 00:27:49.037
We've all been there.

545
00:27:49.297 --> 00:27:50.498
Yeah, it's fun, right?

546
00:27:50.518 --> 00:27:52.420
We get the dopamine hit, vibe coding is cool.

547
00:27:52.480 --> 00:27:53.680
I was just doing it the other day, man.

548
00:27:53.941 --> 00:27:54.181
Yep, yep.

549
00:27:54.201 --> 00:27:55.542
And you're like, wait a minute, wait a minute.

550
00:27:55.562 --> 00:27:56.883
Like, how is this really helping me?

551
00:27:56.903 --> 00:28:01.906
I always say like, hey, if it's keeping you from conversations, like that's the wrong thing, you know?

552
00:28:01.926 --> 00:28:03.107
Yeah, is it making money?

553
00:28:03.867 --> 00:28:04.828
Right, right, exactly.

554
00:28:04.848 --> 00:28:05.128
Making money?

555
00:28:05.228 --> 00:28:05.528
Great.

556
00:28:05.628 --> 00:28:06.449
If not, stop.

557
00:28:06.673 --> 00:28:17.022
Now the other thing that I notice is unique or different about your strategy compared to what I've seen over the years is you're not naming a specific title or topic.

558
00:28:17.382 --> 00:28:20.745
What I mean by that is you have these categories of marketing and branding.

559
00:28:20.885 --> 00:28:24.648
Then you have a video that will probably tell them, hey, here's what we're gonna learn or talk about.

560
00:28:24.988 --> 00:28:31.412
But in my world, a lot of what we do is we'll name a specific class such as how to optimize your Google business profile, right?

561
00:28:31.592 --> 00:28:33.113
So that'll be the class.

562
00:28:33.333 --> 00:28:37.515
But what's very, very interesting to me is you're leaving it more wide open than that.

563
00:28:37.956 --> 00:28:39.617
And they're registering.

564
00:28:39.677 --> 00:28:42.638
They're coming because they want to learn that stuff.

565
00:28:43.058 --> 00:28:44.239
That's from proof.

566
00:28:44.479 --> 00:28:45.760
Proof and brand.

567
00:28:45.900 --> 00:28:46.561
Proof and brand.

568
00:28:46.581 --> 00:28:50.623
So because of the proof, they read the proof, they're like, okay, trust is built, and

569
00:28:50.963 --> 00:28:53.984
You've got a name, a brand established in the community.

570
00:28:54.004 --> 00:28:55.825
So that's doing a lot of heavy lifting for you.

571
00:28:55.845 --> 00:28:55.945
Yeah.

572
00:28:56.345 --> 00:28:56.506
Yeah.

573
00:28:56.766 --> 00:28:57.186
Of course.

574
00:28:57.386 --> 00:29:08.391
And in, in the newsletter, like if I do a blast email, I mean, maybe I'll put in there like bullet points, some of the topics, but, but like, honestly too, I struggle with that because I shift stuff so much too.

575
00:29:08.411 --> 00:29:11.052
Like I may wake up and go through something in the business.

576
00:29:11.072 --> 00:29:12.033
I'm like, this is awesome.

577
00:29:12.053 --> 00:29:14.714
Like I need to share this and I'll totally change what I'm going to present.

578
00:29:15.611 --> 00:29:16.111
Yeah.

579
00:29:16.151 --> 00:29:17.211
Well, that's kind of neat though.

580
00:29:17.231 --> 00:29:18.572
It gives you that, that freedom.

581
00:29:18.612 --> 00:29:19.212
You know what I mean?

582
00:29:19.452 --> 00:29:19.772
Yeah.

583
00:29:19.832 --> 00:29:20.112
Yeah.

584
00:29:20.452 --> 00:29:20.652
Yeah.

585
00:29:20.832 --> 00:29:28.614
But a lot of your stuff, I try to plan it and then we, we don't get to all the topics cause we end up spending, you know, majority of the time on something that people want to talk about.

586
00:29:28.634 --> 00:29:33.975
So, and are a lot of your classes bring laptop, let's do work versus lecture.

587
00:29:34.055 --> 00:29:35.195
I tell them, yeah, bring your laptop.

588
00:29:35.275 --> 00:29:36.615
It's more of a, I like it to be that.

589
00:29:37.656 --> 00:29:38.136
Interesting.

590
00:29:39.316 --> 00:29:40.016
You know, as go ahead.

591
00:29:40.196 --> 00:29:40.536
Go ahead.

592
00:29:41.336 --> 00:29:41.836
No, please.

593
00:29:42.517 --> 00:29:43.757
I lost what I was going to say.

594
00:29:43.777 --> 00:29:44.177
Go for it.

595
00:29:44.599 --> 00:29:50.900
Well, as I think about this, there's various levels of comfort that loan officers have with teaching classes.

596
00:29:51.100 --> 00:29:58.202
You are obviously very comfortable because you've put in the reps and you are also quite educated yourself on the topic.

597
00:29:58.242 --> 00:30:02.463
So therefore, that also gives you confidence to present on these topics.

598
00:30:02.743 --> 00:30:05.143
For instance, let me ask you this completely out of the book.

599
00:30:05.303 --> 00:30:13.305
I haven't even looked you up yet on Google, but how comfortable would you be if you had to teach a class on Google Profile next week?

600
00:30:13.465 --> 00:30:15.887
To the people, it depends who the audience is.

601
00:30:16.788 --> 00:30:17.389
The agents.

602
00:30:18.170 --> 00:30:21.373
I would be comfortable doing it because I know most people don't even have the bare minimum.

603
00:30:21.713 --> 00:30:28.259
It would just be more surface level because I'm not the best at, like, I have a Google profile, but I'm not, I'm sure there's more I could be doing.

604
00:30:28.580 --> 00:30:30.441
But like you said, it's confidence.

605
00:30:30.682 --> 00:30:34.505
Like, I don't talk about mortgage technicals because I just don't know it enough to do it.

606
00:30:34.545 --> 00:30:36.848
Like, that's really what it comes down to.

607
00:30:37.108 --> 00:30:37.688
That's funny.

608
00:30:38.349 --> 00:30:42.914
Talk about the things you love to talk about and like you'll be you'll be more confident at it.

609
00:30:42.994 --> 00:30:46.478
People will trust you on it and it keeps something that's sustainable.

610
00:30:46.738 --> 00:30:51.843
Like the only way that I'm going to maintain this level of output is because I'm talking about things that I just like.

611
00:30:51.983 --> 00:30:54.466
So I imagine you have a really solid LOA and processor.

612
00:30:55.207 --> 00:30:55.447
I do.

613
00:30:55.467 --> 00:30:55.787
Of course.

614
00:30:56.348 --> 00:30:56.628
Yeah.

615
00:30:56.688 --> 00:30:56.909
Right.

616
00:30:56.929 --> 00:30:58.490
Because you're like, I don't know.

617
00:30:58.510 --> 00:30:59.271
What are the guidelines?

618
00:30:59.351 --> 00:30:59.772
I don't know.

619
00:30:59.812 --> 00:31:00.713
Well, you look them up.

620
00:31:02.217 --> 00:31:03.438
Well, that's the thing too.

621
00:31:03.458 --> 00:31:10.942
Like I was telling you off camera, like I cut, I cut off so many products because it's just like, I don't know these things.

622
00:31:10.962 --> 00:31:16.985
And by focusing in on a smaller amount of like services, you can just get really good at them.

623
00:31:17.005 --> 00:31:18.545
Like I can easily structure a loan.

624
00:31:18.625 --> 00:31:20.346
I know it's, I know it's going to get done or not.

625
00:31:20.386 --> 00:31:23.208
And that's less risk on, on my end.

626
00:31:23.568 --> 00:31:23.748
Right.

627
00:31:23.968 --> 00:31:28.450
Yeah, I want to double tap on that because we did mention it before we hit record.

628
00:31:28.470 --> 00:31:41.175
What you told me was you were getting in the weeds with non-QM loans and it was really bogging down your process, perhaps your ability to handle volume, and you made a decision to essentially cut that from your portfolio, right?

629
00:31:42.049 --> 00:31:43.870
Yeah, exactly what you said.

630
00:31:43.910 --> 00:31:45.351
We were doing a decent amount of it.

631
00:31:45.531 --> 00:31:47.953
And like, it's a huge, it's a huge market right now.

632
00:31:48.293 --> 00:31:49.814
It's very, it can be very profitable.

633
00:31:50.154 --> 00:31:51.155
Like, I'm not doubting any of that.

634
00:31:51.175 --> 00:31:52.436
A lot of companies are pushing that.

635
00:31:52.776 --> 00:31:59.100
But also, you don't, most people have not saturated their market in the business that they already know.

636
00:31:59.120 --> 00:32:05.905
They don't have to go learn and research and figure out a broker and deal with guidelines and deal with all this manual underwriting because that's what not QM is.

637
00:32:06.285 --> 00:32:14.208
Like it just creates so much more layers and time away from the things that actually matter, which as a broker, it's acquiring the customer.

638
00:32:14.857 --> 00:32:15.057
Yeah.

639
00:32:15.838 --> 00:32:19.700
And also like if you have a support team, like that's not easy on them too.

640
00:32:19.800 --> 00:32:29.367
I mean, I, there was, I mean, you can totally tell when you're sending bad loans in how your operations team feels and how they perform and their sentiment when you're on them.

641
00:32:29.387 --> 00:32:35.892
Like we're all virtual pretty much, but like you get on, I use Slack and I get on Slack and you can tell, you can tell people feel.

642
00:32:36.152 --> 00:32:38.954
And as soon as I got rid of the non-QM, people's lives got better.

643
00:32:39.234 --> 00:32:41.114
That's a pretty bold decision.

644
00:32:41.715 --> 00:32:45.876
Have you ever, so what happens when you have to say no to somebody because they don't fit the conventional mold?

645
00:32:46.216 --> 00:32:47.156
I just refer it out.

646
00:32:47.256 --> 00:32:47.876
I refer it out.

647
00:32:48.136 --> 00:32:51.297
Like, yeah, like a bank statement.

648
00:32:51.397 --> 00:32:52.677
Is that what you're kind of referring to?

649
00:32:52.717 --> 00:32:58.418
Like, I just, it's not worth it because what if that one deal, I miss something and I screw up a deal.

650
00:32:58.679 --> 00:33:04.760
Now I have a mad client, a mad buyer's agent, a mad listing agent, and like it's reputation because I didn't know that.

651
00:33:05.160 --> 00:33:07.441
It's very instructive for business.

652
00:33:07.741 --> 00:33:09.481
It's very hard for people to do.

653
00:33:09.521 --> 00:33:13.402
I'm sure we have some people listening really trying to settle that in their mind.

654
00:33:13.742 --> 00:33:19.044
But if you think about it, you know, in the big picture of things, it's about what are you really going for, I guess.

655
00:33:19.264 --> 00:33:22.145
And if you're going for a goal of 100 units a month,

656
00:33:22.785 --> 00:33:27.950
You're not going to be able to do that doing ABXYZ monkey wrench loan, right?

657
00:33:28.290 --> 00:33:32.494
You've got to build a machine that scales and that's why you made that choice.

658
00:33:32.754 --> 00:33:37.438
Yeah, you got to get rid of subtraction.

659
00:33:37.699 --> 00:33:38.700
What are the ideas they're called?

660
00:33:38.720 --> 00:33:40.601
Like subtraction is addition, right?

661
00:33:40.621 --> 00:33:41.822
Yes, yes, yes.

662
00:33:42.443 --> 00:33:45.806
There's a book that I listened to and it just came out, The Algorithm.

663
00:33:45.866 --> 00:33:46.767
Have you heard of The Algorithm?

664
00:33:47.447 --> 00:33:48.487
No, but I'm writing it down.

665
00:33:48.748 --> 00:33:49.908
It's so freaking solid.

666
00:33:49.928 --> 00:33:52.609
I recommend everybody, especially broker owners, to go listen to it.

667
00:33:52.929 --> 00:33:56.951
It basically was written by the president or he was the president of Tesla.

668
00:33:57.131 --> 00:34:06.214
The president of Tesla, he worked with Elon for like, I think it was four or five years, but he walked through Elon's process of how he ran manufacturing.

669
00:34:06.234 --> 00:34:12.777
And the biggest takeaway for me was basically like question all the requirements and delete as much as possible.

670
00:34:13.177 --> 00:34:25.300
Like delete, like you have all these things you need to do to get done, whether it's for marketing, for workshops, for, for actual doing the loan, for processing, for your funding process, like, like look at everything that happens and just delete as much as possible.

671
00:34:26.260 --> 00:34:34.322
And when you do that, that was a part of me deleting non-QM because it's like, that was a whole nother, nother set of processes and workflows.

672
00:34:34.643 --> 00:34:34.743
Yeah.

673
00:34:34.763 --> 00:34:35.883
We just got rid of.

674
00:34:36.943 --> 00:34:37.203
Yeah.

675
00:34:37.243 --> 00:34:40.004
And it was costing you ultimately in the, in the big picture.

676
00:34:40.728 --> 00:34:41.148
Totally.

677
00:34:41.329 --> 00:34:46.112
And a lot of people can't get their head around that because they haven't like they have to get you have to get.

678
00:34:46.132 --> 00:34:47.934
And I'm not I don't know, I'm probably not even there yet.

679
00:34:47.954 --> 00:34:54.619
Like you have to get to the point where you're just so confident that like the services that we offer are the best in the market and we're so good at it.

680
00:34:54.659 --> 00:35:00.744
And it's OK that we're not going to follow this other stuff, because if we just be really good at this thing, we are going to get all the business we could possibly have.

681
00:35:01.264 --> 00:35:01.465
Yeah.

682
00:35:01.805 --> 00:35:02.466
No, it's very smart.

683
00:35:02.546 --> 00:35:03.207
It's very strategic.

684
00:35:03.267 --> 00:35:08.173
And like I said, it's difficult for some people to do, but if you're going for scale, right, then that's your thing.

685
00:35:08.193 --> 00:35:12.178
If you're looking to do three, four loans a month and that's it, well, you can probably handle that, you know?

686
00:35:12.358 --> 00:35:13.159
So you got to do what's right for you.

687
00:35:13.499 --> 00:35:13.719
All right.

688
00:35:13.759 --> 00:35:16.643
Here's a kind of like an overarching all question before we wrap up.

689
00:35:16.903 --> 00:35:21.648
Of all the ways to get realtors, I'm sure you've, like you said, you do the other things.

690
00:35:21.668 --> 00:35:22.830
You do the calls and the calls.

691
00:35:23.150 --> 00:35:23.490
Why?

692
00:35:23.690 --> 00:35:26.273
But you've obviously gone, quote, all in on events.

693
00:35:26.534 --> 00:35:29.577
Why is it events versus something else?

694
00:35:29.757 --> 00:35:32.740
Like maybe social media or I don't know.

695
00:35:32.760 --> 00:35:35.163
But why have you decided to go all in on events?

696
00:35:35.403 --> 00:35:39.745
Because it's a combination of two things that I know work.

697
00:35:40.105 --> 00:35:40.925
Relationships work.

698
00:35:41.285 --> 00:35:44.766
And I know if you go all into social media, which I haven't, that will also work.

699
00:35:45.127 --> 00:35:47.067
Events and in-person workshops are a hybrid.

700
00:35:47.107 --> 00:35:51.649
It's one-to-many marketing that also is still very relationship-driven because they're in-person and they're with me.

701
00:35:51.949 --> 00:35:53.309
One-to-many is huge, right?

702
00:35:53.329 --> 00:36:00.332
Because it's the same amount of effort if I'm here in person talking to two realtors or to 10 or to 50 or 100 if I can fill up webinars.

703
00:36:00.472 --> 00:36:00.692
Right.

704
00:36:00.992 --> 00:36:01.792
So that's massive.

705
00:36:01.932 --> 00:36:02.853
That creates leverage.

706
00:36:03.073 --> 00:36:04.873
Why I haven't gone all in on social.

707
00:36:04.993 --> 00:36:06.173
I just, I don't have the bandwidth.

708
00:36:06.453 --> 00:36:07.994
I, I, I want to do that.

709
00:36:08.114 --> 00:36:19.577
I could see, I would like to have that going by maybe Q2 of next year, but like the way that I would want to do it is kind of like what I'm doing with the workshops now is I want to like go all in on it.

710
00:36:19.677 --> 00:36:19.837
Right.

711
00:36:19.857 --> 00:36:28.919
And I just don't have the bandwidth and I don't want to spread myself too thin before I give say this, the full like time it needs to get kickin.

712
00:36:29.986 --> 00:36:53.183
very mature and wise for such a young man that's awesome okay real quick anything you also mentioned financial advisors cpas anything quick you want to share there in terms of like what what percentage of of your business is that maybe 10 that's just you're getting your again with relationships and if you can get into databases

713
00:36:53.543 --> 00:36:53.743
Right.

714
00:36:53.783 --> 00:36:55.504
Like that's, that's what that is.

715
00:36:55.724 --> 00:36:55.944
Right.

716
00:36:56.004 --> 00:37:03.047
I mean, accountants have like one of my best friends owns accounting firm and there's thousands of clients there or, you know, financial advisors have these big books of business.

717
00:37:03.087 --> 00:37:10.471
So if you build relationships with those people and you can get into their databases, meaning they promote you, they, I mean, it's, it's really easy.

718
00:37:11.231 --> 00:37:15.393
You'll get, you'll get low, low, like you don't need to do a, spend a lot of effort on it.

719
00:37:15.573 --> 00:37:16.134
You know, it's funny.

720
00:37:16.174 --> 00:37:21.520
I played a game once with Todd Ballinger, who's big on CPAs and financial advisors.

721
00:37:21.540 --> 00:37:22.461
I don't know if you know who he is.

722
00:37:22.782 --> 00:37:28.269
But we were doing the realtor versus financial advisor war, if you will, or battle, right?

723
00:37:28.309 --> 00:37:29.750
Battle of the two referral sources.

724
00:37:29.931 --> 00:37:34.216
Which one do you think is, I don't know if better is the word, but let's just go with that.

725
00:37:34.476 --> 00:37:38.879
Well, it'd be crazy if I said finance advisors because 90% of my business is realtors.

726
00:37:38.919 --> 00:37:40.460
So I'm going to go with realtors.

727
00:37:41.061 --> 00:37:42.522
But it gets down to why.

728
00:37:42.982 --> 00:37:51.128
So like my friend Wally Elliberry, right, who's like all in on financial advisors and has a system for add millions of business and business to his portfolio.

729
00:37:51.388 --> 00:37:52.548
It's a different approach, right?

730
00:37:52.609 --> 00:37:54.130
It's a different vibe.

731
00:37:55.094 --> 00:37:55.995
But here's my answer.

732
00:37:56.035 --> 00:37:57.115
Tell me what you think about this.

733
00:37:57.155 --> 00:37:58.256
This is for you, the listener, too.

734
00:37:58.476 --> 00:38:09.443
If it's the right realtor, let's assume the synergy of the relationship is right, they are the only, let's just face it, they get paid to send you buyers, listing agents aside for the minute.

735
00:38:09.843 --> 00:38:18.509
But no one else in my mind, as far as a referral partner, has vested interest-wise to drum up potential clients for you

736
00:38:19.209 --> 00:38:22.732
on such an ongoing basis because they don't eat without transactions.

737
00:38:23.233 --> 00:38:25.815
Financial advisors have another end of their business and all that stuff.

738
00:38:26.215 --> 00:38:27.677
And yes, those can be great referrals.

739
00:38:27.697 --> 00:38:29.958
But to me, it's just the quantity, right?

740
00:38:30.239 --> 00:38:41.669
It's the depth and breadth of what realtors whole business is about, which is why I definitely want to have that as a pillar, not the only pillar, but a very strong pillar.

741
00:38:42.009 --> 00:38:43.190
What say you, my good man?

742
00:38:43.450 --> 00:38:44.671
I agree with that.

743
00:38:45.512 --> 00:38:47.413
I think all of it works.

744
00:38:47.754 --> 00:38:50.996
Just pick what you like to do better and just do more of that, right?

745
00:38:51.016 --> 00:38:52.498
There you go.

746
00:38:52.618 --> 00:38:56.921
Realtors, yeah, their main job is to go get the same clients that we want to work with.

747
00:38:57.282 --> 00:39:02.206
I think a lot of people just get burnt out and they don't like working with realtors because a lot of times they're just not nice people.

748
00:39:02.226 --> 00:39:02.666
You know what I mean?

749
00:39:02.686 --> 00:39:05.188
They don't understand what it actually goes into the stuff that we do.

750
00:39:05.269 --> 00:39:08.892
So shifting your framework to creating a system like real estate.

751
00:39:09.472 --> 00:39:12.133
That's just a, it's, it's, it's a feature, not a bug.

752
00:39:12.233 --> 00:39:12.473
Right.

753
00:39:12.893 --> 00:39:18.635
So expect that, expect that that's how this is going to be when you're, when you're working with a lot of different realtors.

754
00:39:18.655 --> 00:39:23.537
Now, yeah, if you want to do, like you said, four, four loans a month, we'll go find three people and become great friends with them.

755
00:39:23.617 --> 00:39:24.698
Like get producer.

756
00:39:25.038 --> 00:39:26.078
But like, I don't do any of that.

757
00:39:26.158 --> 00:39:28.459
I don't, I'm not personally, I'm not into sports.

758
00:39:28.599 --> 00:39:30.160
Like I just don't go to sporting games.

759
00:39:30.220 --> 00:39:30.980
I just don't like it.

760
00:39:31.340 --> 00:39:35.682
I like to build and work and I don't go take, I don't golf.

761
00:39:35.862 --> 00:39:39.063
Like I don't do this stuff that a lot of people win business by doing.

762
00:39:39.283 --> 00:39:40.504
And I'm okay with that, you know?

763
00:39:40.564 --> 00:39:45.826
And if somebody wants to work with somebody who only takes them out to golf and fishing trips, then great, do that.

764
00:39:45.886 --> 00:39:47.287
Like, it doesn't bother me.

765
00:39:47.347 --> 00:39:54.091
Like, I'm gonna build something that's sustainable for me, which is not sitting five hours and watching a baseball game, in my opinion, so.

766
00:39:54.271 --> 00:39:54.491
True.

767
00:39:54.811 --> 00:39:58.273
Yeah, I think the key word you said there, key phrase was like, I say that as well.

768
00:39:58.313 --> 00:39:58.953
Everything works.

769
00:39:59.394 --> 00:40:02.435
It just doesn't work equally well everywhere for everybody, right?

770
00:40:02.455 --> 00:40:07.518
So you gotta pick what's working for you, where you're at in your current stage of your business, et cetera.

771
00:40:07.538 --> 00:40:07.638
Yeah.

772
00:40:08.735 --> 00:40:09.075
Totally.

773
00:40:09.095 --> 00:40:10.216
All right, man.

774
00:40:10.236 --> 00:40:11.677
Well, this has been very insightful.

775
00:40:11.777 --> 00:40:12.858
It's been educational for me.

776
00:40:12.898 --> 00:40:14.739
I've learned a lot, and I think the listeners have too.

777
00:40:15.099 --> 00:40:23.705
For anybody who wants to follow you, we're going to put your Instagram link in the show notes, but it's logan.lindstrm, L-I-N-D-S-T-R-U-N. Instagram.

778
00:40:23.905 --> 00:40:25.566
You're putting up some cool content there as well.

779
00:40:25.646 --> 00:40:28.088
So, Logan, thank you so much for making time.

780
00:40:28.268 --> 00:40:28.668
Thanks, Jeff.

781
00:40:28.688 --> 00:40:29.449
Appreciate you having me.

782
00:40:29.649 --> 00:40:30.670
Yeah, my pleasure, listeners.

783
00:40:30.690 --> 00:40:31.330
You know what to do.

784
00:40:31.590 --> 00:40:36.794
If you like what you heard today, go ahead and follow Logan and let him know what your one key takeaway was from this episode.

785
00:40:36.874 --> 00:40:37.814
The link will be in the show notes.

786
00:40:38.155 --> 00:40:38.995
We'll see you on the next one.

787
00:40:39.415 --> 00:40:39.796
Bye for now.

788
00:40:39.836 --> 00:40:40.536
Well, there you heard it.

789
00:40:40.616 --> 00:40:46.360
There's Logan using agent classes to multiply his revenue without chasing or cold calling.

790
00:40:46.700 --> 00:40:50.843
So if you're interested in teaching classes to grow your business, I got an invitation for you.

791
00:40:51.043 --> 00:40:57.846
It's my free five-day email course on hosting an agent class that fills seats and turns attendees into referral partners.

792
00:40:57.986 --> 00:40:58.906
The chase doesn't scale.

793
00:40:59.006 --> 00:41:02.088
One coffee, one agent, one hour, then you do it again tomorrow.

794
00:41:02.328 --> 00:41:04.949
The agent who says let's stay in touch doesn't answer when you call.

795
00:41:05.569 --> 00:41:07.670
Here's what changes when you teach instead of chase.

796
00:41:07.970 --> 00:41:09.431
You meet 20 agents in an hour.

797
00:41:09.691 --> 00:41:12.612
You walk in as the expert, not the vendor with the rate sheet.

798
00:41:13.052 --> 00:41:17.094
Agents call you because you've taught them something they needed and you own the room.

799
00:41:17.195 --> 00:41:34.965
So if you've been teaching agent classes, you want to get a better result, maybe you've tried it in the past, or maybe it's brand new for you, you haven't tried it at all, and you're looking for a proven method and system to host an agent class that fills seats and turns attendees into referral partners, I want you to check out my free mini email course, The Agent Class Method.

800
00:41:35.265 --> 00:41:36.025
Here's what you're going to get.

801
00:41:36.105 --> 00:41:42.567
Day one, why one-to-one doesn't scale, and the principle of leverage that I learned from Tony Robbins that changes everything.

802
00:41:42.807 --> 00:41:46.688
Day two, you're going to get insights into what agents actually care about.

803
00:41:47.028 --> 00:41:47.928
Hey, here's a small clue.

804
00:41:48.048 --> 00:41:48.888
It's not mortgages.

805
00:41:49.208 --> 00:41:52.089
Day three, the promotion plan that gets agents to actually show up.

806
00:41:52.349 --> 00:41:55.930
Day four, the 72-hour framework that turns attendees into referral partners.

807
00:41:56.270 --> 00:42:00.591
And day five, why one class isn't enough and why that's actually good news.

808
00:42:00.671 --> 00:42:05.052
You'll see how running classes every six weeks builds a predictable referral machine for you.

809
00:42:05.553 --> 00:42:14.566
So if you want to check out the free email mini course, check the link in the show notes or go to myagentclasses.com forward slash email course and get yours today.