Ep 150: How To Know When to Hire Your First Assistant

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Go check it out right now, visit LOKestudy.com and download your free copy today. Welcome to Mortgage Marketing Radio. Brought to you by the Mortgage Marketing Institute, your number one source for truth in mortgage marketing. Hey, hey listeners, what's up? This is Jeff Zimfer, your humble host for Mortgage Marketing Radio Podcast. I'm so thrilled to tune in. Man, what a privilege it is every week to have a few minutes of your time to share what I hope are impactful conversations, ideas with you that you will take and apply in your life and in your mortgage business to have more value, more significance, more fun, obviously make more money in your business. If that's what you're getting from listening to these podcasts, I'm the one who's actually benefiting more. I get more out of these by hearing your feedback on the podcasts. Perhaps then you get because it's just part of my how I'm wired to the heart of a teacher and a passion to give back to the industry that gave so much to me and I think is an incredible industry for those that are willing to evolve and grow and continue to adapt and learn from others and share, right? So I thank you for tuning in. Speaking of getting feedback from you listeners, I got to give a shout out to one of our more recent reviews. Cliff Jennings left us a nice five-star review. Here's what Cliff says, fresh new mortgage podcast, such a refreshing podcast for mortgage loan originators everywhere. So many other podcasts are outdated and can ramble so quickly. I haven't been bored yet. Thank you. We have this podcast, great new ideas, wonderful interviewees, listen and learn people. Cliff Jennings, thank you sir, I appreciate you man. You know what to do. Hit me up on the Facebook. DM me, send me your t-shirt size and mailing address and let's get you off a swag box. Okay, so that's what you know. If you want to leave a review, that's what you know to do. You can do it. You know how to do it. Let's do it. Speaking of doing it, let's get into this week's episode. My special guest is Dan and Chetta and Dan is out of a Northern California, Petaluma, a highly competitive area. Why I'm bringing Dan on is this, oftentimes I have conversations with loan originators who are talking about bringing on an assistant. They're usually that's what they're doing, talking about instead of doing it. They're realizing that they need an assistant. They need support to help to grow. And here's the old saying, right, if you don't have an assistant, you are the assistant. What I love about Dan and why we're having this conversation is there's only been in the business three years, three short years, but Dan early on realized the importance of having an assistant. And so I wanted to unpack the conversation of what is the transition that he went through to hiring his first assistant and all the things that are involved in deciding to hire an assistant, who do you hire, how do you know if the right person for the job, what are the roles that they do and things like that. And I tell you what, Dan will tell you as you'll hear on this interview that it allowed him to double his volume, right? So in 2018, he did 20 million. In 2019, he's closing out at 82 units and 40 million. And he's going to grow even more in 2020. He's already looking at bringing on his next hire, which is more of a biz dev development role. So Dan can stay in his lane of excellence in his wheelhouse. And that is serving clients, meeting and greeting and talking to people. So I thought it would be relevant to have a conversation around this, right, with regards to bringing on an assistant and things like that. So hopefully there's some key takeaways and nuggets you can learn from our conversation with Dan and Shetta. And as always, if you're looking for more growth, feel free to check out the mortgagemarketing.pro website, where you can learn more about how to grow your business, whether it be from getting maximum referrals and minimum time, whether getting started with video, Instagram, YouTube, all the socials becoming a modern originator, mortgagemarketing.pro, check out the quick video. And we'll put links to everything we mentioned. As always in the podcast, show notes so you can easily click and go check it out right from your mobile phone, wherever you're listening to this. So without further ado, let's get into this week's show. Dan, welcome to the show. Right on, man. Thanks for having me. Thanks for being here. I know you're busy and great to connect with you. If you wouldn't mind just, you know, for the listeners, they heard my kind of formal intro about you, but give us the Dan and Shetta version of how long in the biz, like rough, roughly production and what do you love about this business? Right on. Yes. I started June 1, 2016, and I remember that because it was the month that Brexit happened. And like the whole world was in turmoil. And I had no idea what I was getting myself into. I just ended up a career as a commercial banker at a community bank and doing mostly business lending and that sort of thing. And thought I'd give this whole mortgage thing a try because I just figured there was a better way for me to spend my time and make money and provide for my family. So I thought, hey, I know how to manage relationships, I know how to make loans. So let's figure out this whole mortgage thing. So I always joke with people that I don't know the world before trade. I didn't do a loan before trade existed. So it's kind of a, maybe a blessing in disguise because it's just kind of normal. So yeah. So half the year in 2016, I'm just like, my number is the new you're going to ask me. You did about 10 million in that first six months. And then 2017, it did like 13 million, 2018, it did about 20. And this year, I'll do 40. Okay. Got it. So 2019 closing out on 40 million in three years. Yeah. Yeah. That's a pretty quick ride. What part of the country you in? I'm in the Bay Area in San Francisco, Bay Area. All right. So arguably a competitive market. Yep. Very competitive. Yeah. We know we've got some players up there. Yes. In my town. They're here. Yeah. I know. Right. I've interviewed some of them in your town. What do you attribute that? That's a very fast growth, man. I mean, I talked to the people have been in the business. And by the way, how many units is that? Just to give some. That's right. Just looking at 82 units. Okay. 82 units. Okay. So nothing, you know, that's that's solid, man. What do you attribute that growth to though in three short years? Yeah. So the big change I made this year is I hired a full-time assistant to help with my production. I like the kind of phrase of like, only do the things that only you can do. And so really learning how to delegate as much as possible so that she can take on as many of the roles within a transaction as possible. So really all I'm trying to spend my time is not not perfect at it. But what I'm trying to do is just spend as much as my time as possible, building trust with clients and referral partners, finding the business, bringing it in the face of every transaction. I don't delegate to other people and say, this person is now your transaction coordinator. They're going to see it through the close on the person through the entire entire process. But having that full-time dedicated assistant has just been a total game changer for me. So I was kind of on the roller coaster due to two, do three, do zero, do four, do zero. And now it's been pretty consistent, you know, somewhere between eight and 15 runs a month. Right. And we're going to unpack this. That's kind of the focus of our conversation is the transition to hiring your first assistant. I think that's the name of this episode. Before I forget though, 2020, what do you forecast in for that? Have you built any of that out yet? Yeah, so I was just talking to my coach about that. So I'm a dunk tonight. I guess I'll just be for that dunk tonight. So my coach is an amazing woman tree so that you have a connect with her, you totally should. And she has a great business up in Lake Tahoe area. Anyway, we're just looking at the numbers. I think it's going to be 60. I think. Like that five million a month on average. Another is great. I'm actually in the process of thinking about the next higher. Probably changing my workflow a little bit, but good to kind of team of three would be the ideal situation from you right now. All right. So let's unpack this assistant situation for everybody listening, seeing as you went through transition. Take, take me back to like that. That's the stage or the time that you first realized you perhaps needed help. And what kind of struggles did you deal with? Did you like, you know, deal with that usual conversation of, hey, I don't want to spend the money. I can't afford it. Whatever. Take us through that a little bit. Yeah. So you always ask when's the right time to hire an assistant? And my answer is when you're serious about growing your business. So when I hired the assistant, I really didn't need her in terms of, you know, my production at that moment. But I had a vision for what I wanted to my business to look like what I wanted my practice to look like. So I went out on a limb and kind of talked to my managers, okay, this is what I'm thinking about doing. He's like, okay, I don't see why you need that, but if they're feeling that strongly about it, then we'll figure that out. So, so yeah, so we hired her and went through kind of a total like restoration of my process, just like really looking at everything from start to finish. Like, what is the borrower experience look like? And from my standpoint, we all sell the same product and our rates are probably very close to each other. And our market is pretty competitive that you're not seeing crazy differences and really kind of the same stuff. So the only thing that in my estimation that makes me different is the borrower experience that they have and that level of customer experience. How I interact with them, how we communicate, how I make them feel, and that's really it. So that's my whole focus is like, how does the borrower feel through the process? Are we connecting with them emotionally? Are we meeting them where they are and taking care of them? It's a hard, it's a big, huge financial decision and our job is to give them ease and make sure that they know that they're making a good decision. Yeah, let me ask you a few questions then around the assistant. So you opted to, you didn't get any support financially. Right, so exactly. Okay, so initially no support financially, like I'm going to invest in this all on my own. Okay, so there's that you're really, this goes back to what you said about how do you know when it's time to hire your first assistant. It's when you realize you're committed to the business. That's the actual business I assume, right? Not just be a quote sales person. Right, so I think, so the cool thing about the business is that you can kind of do whatever you want to do. If you're happy doing the two, three, four loans a month and that provides you living and maybe that's what you want to do. And it gives you enough time to go with your family or anyone. And that's great. You should totally do that. I kind of had some, I took a step back in that kind of coaching exercise that I've been going through. I was looking at like big goals, like, where do I want to be? I'm 35, it's like, where do I want to be when I'm 45? What does my life look like when I'm 50? And I had this conversation with my wife and we kind of sat down like, what does it look like? And then kind of peeled that back and go, well, what do we need to do this year or today or in this hour to realize that bigger goal? And so when I was doing that kind of visioning, I saw that I wasn't going to get where I wanted to be doing the two, three, four loans a month. And I really wanted to commit to, you know, really going after it and building something that could really generate wealth. It can really provide for my family and, you know, have the have the beautiful life. Right. Exactly. Clarity is helpful. Okay. So you're investing in your own assistant. How did you find the assistant? What processes did you go through? Did you interview a bunch of people all that? I interviewed nobody. She was actually a processor here within the office. Okay. And she was my processor and she worked with me and probably four other lenders here in team. And she was a great fit and she wanted a little more and to grow her skill set. And so it was just a perfect match and they backfilled her position. So those other lenders have their own processor again. Yeah. So you approached the company and they're like, Hey, I want to take this person out of this role. Yeah. And they were okay with it. Yeah. Wow. All right. Good. Nice, man. Okay. So what are some lessons learned? Because being a processor is different than an assistant. Yeah. And what are some lessons learned and how did her role change? Let's get specific on what she does for you to help you generate more business. So yeah. So she like still does all the processing too. Yeah. Nice. Okay. And really the role that we added on to her day was with the time that she was using the process for other people. She does more of the assistant work. So she does like all of the like income calculation stuff where I would sit here and get an Excel and figure out what people's in qualifying income is. She does all that on the pre approval side. She writes all the pre approval letters. Well, let me let me interrupt. Sorry. Let's back up for a minute. Then take me from the point of entry. I'm a client. I'm referred to you or whatever. I, you know, you're the first call. Yep. Okay. Let's take us through your customer experience. That's important to you. Totally. So usually it's a phone call that we have at first and it's just kind of a needs analysis. Tell me basically what you're looking for. Let's make sure that we're a style match. And you know, if you're in the low cost leader people, I'll tell you I'm not not the person for you. Where we have super competitive rates, but you can find cheaper. And I like to be up front with people like if you want the cheapest cheapest cheapest rate, go online. Find someone that will give you bare bones experience and you can save an eighth. Have fun. It's going to be like torture. It's going to be painful, but you can make it happen. So we have that conversation. I sent them a needs list. They either apply with me on the phone or send them an online link. Just depends on what their comfort level is. And really in that conversation, it's about needs analysis, timing, understanding what they're looking for. And then I kind of cater my approach to them. So some people just want to do everything over the phone and by text other people are like, let's get in face to face. My preference is that we get face to face and I try to get that as much as possible. I think there's something to that. I think on one of your podcasts recently that talk about like looking at them. And you can see if they're actually understanding physically. Right. Visual cues. I said that was the spot on it. I don't remember which one that was. But yeah, so I like to get your take. You're taking the app. I'm taking the app. Okay. I take the app. I do the collection of the financial documents. Pass them over to my assistant who's actually doesn't work in the same office as I do. She's in a different office. Okay. And then she'll sort through all that stuff and figure out what we need. She sends me a needs list. And. You've got an advantage in that she did processing. Exactly. Yeah. I'm leveraging her. Her. Her strong suit, which is she knows how to process a file and package and put it together and prepare it for an undergrad or look at. And so she kind of cut through all that red tape and was like, I don't need taxes just. I mean, this is a W2 only file. Well, that's. That was a good find to be able to get her around. So she's. She's awesome. So she. She makes the streamlines the process from the beginning. So I only asked for what I really need. And you know, she kind of ends that. All right. So you got the you got the 10 or 3 of the app and then they're going to come in or not. You're going to do it over a phone or text or whatever. Yeah. Where are you involved in the process throughout the rest of the transaction? So no, no. Who's my assistant? She drives everything kind of behind the scenes. And she's talking to the title company. She's talking. She does all the other stuff. Ordering a praise all. That's exactly. Basically, the only. And she tells me what I need to do. And I am the one who actually talks to the client. So if we need something from the client, I get an email from now saying, I need XYZ. I call the client and say, hey, we're working on a file. Here's what's going on. This is what I need from you. Let me ask you this. That was a conscious choice for you to make those calls versus her. And she also, if she needs a correspondent with the client or someone, it comes from my email. Because she likes it. No. No, she's not licensed. But why, why are you choosing? Because some people choose the opposite, right? Some people choose to have their assistant called to get conditions and all that. Why are you choosing to have you do it? Because when I, in my personal, my personal preference, that when I'm doing business with a person, I want to do business with that person. Right? So I always as annoyed me as a consumer when I think I'm doing business with somebody, but then their assistant or their someone or their whoever calls and they're like, hey, I'm actually the one who's doing this. For me, when I was designing it, I thought was better for my style was that I'm going to offload as much as I can behind the scenes and let other people do as much as they can behind the curtain. But in terms of the customer experience, they're doing business with me, not my assistant. That makes sense. And a lot of people have really amazing businesses where they have, you know, I was talking to someone at an event and they're like, I don't actually do customer consultations. That's really cool. That's totally your style and you should. Well, and that's the beauty, like you pointed out earlier, that's the reality of this business. You can design it any way you want. And everything, different markets work differently, different, you know, different type of client bases work differently. And this is what I found is work best for me and my clients. Okay. Like that, like that. Okay, so you're interfacing. What is your kind of your cadence or your schedule of meetings with your L.O.A.? Like I know some people have a daily debrief for 15 minutes. What does yours look like? Yeah, we do like a pipeline review every day in theory. Okay. And stuff of the phone or whatever over the phone. Yeah. And then we get together at least every other week for face to face. We're choosing probably 20 minute drive away. So we meet in the town that's in between us and grab a cup of coffee just to have that face time. Sure. Talk about more strategic things and just like, hey, here's the next thing I want you to take on. Here's what I'm thinking, you know, pipeline management wise. Here's the next exercise that we're going to go through. Here's the new, you know, marketing initiative that we're going to take on. Whatever it is, that we do all that type of stuff face to face. But we were talking constantly throughout the day. Right. I call her in between meetings just to check in like, hey, did this thing happen? Did that happen? Did that happen? That appraisers late. Can we, you know, get that AMC to spur them along? Whatever those deals are, you know. Yeah. Okay. So she's handling the backend stuff, all that kind of. Again, I think I'm just thinking of what you said here. Income calculations, which is not what I often hear with that with a L.O.A. Yeah. Another benefit, of course, to her knowledge base. What other types of things do you have her doing to free you up that? Are they not loan related, such as biz dev or marketing related? Yeah. So she does like financing flyers. If I, if any of my real to partners are doing an open house or have a listing, then I'll just send her. Hey, here's a new listing for so and so. And she does all these templates and she'll actually create the flyers that are all. And through marketing compliance on stuff. Let me ask you a question on that, seeing as that's a hot topic, financing flyers, right? That flies around the social groups. Do you have agents asking those for those? Do you find that they like them? Do you think that helps solidify your relationship? Yes, all of those. Yeah. I think I can, in the years I've been doing it, I think I've done one deal. I've got one phone call from someone who's like, hey, I picked up a financing flyer. What? And I want you to do our loan. So, you know, I pay it, probably pays for it for the life I ever. Sure. Forever. But I use that mostly as a touch point to let the agents know that I'm paying attention. And to is a reason to call. And, you know, I try to touch base with my partners as much as possible and to be a value add. So I'll actually work open houses and spend time with them. Mostly, I'm not there. If I get a lead that day is great. But mostly it's about solidifying the real partnership and letting my care. And I'll invest my Sunday afternoon to spend with them. Having been so much lately because we have a 13 week at home. People are home. So I've been kind of slammed on the personal side. Congratulations to that, man. Catching apps when you can or were you the one telling me that? No, you've got a good sleeper on your hands. We have a pretty good sleeper. You know, we trade off in shifts. It's kind of like all take her for a few hours of mom can lay down and get some. Get some rest in the dark and then we switch and. That's awesome. Make it happen. Okay. What else do you want to share about your assistant, your process together? Things that you do. Maybe something unique. Yeah. So I think the big thing is just we talk all the time, kind of constant communication. And I totally trust her. I am. That's key point. I trust that she is going to. I don't ask her to lock in. She doesn't work in the same office as me. I actually have no idea what she's doing at this particular moment. I trust that she's getting stuff done. And I know that she's getting stuff done because loans close on time. Stuff happens. I get CCed on emails and I see that things are going on. And I think that's the biggest thing is that. You have to trust your partners and you have to have a. A relationship where you know that they're doing what they're supposed to be doing. So you can do what you need to do. Yeah. Exactly. That's a key point there. Trust for sure. And again, you've got the benefit of you had been working with her already. So you guys have that relationship. So that's that's nice. Smart of you to probably recognize that. Right. Yes. No, thanks. I tried to try to use my head. It's a pretty critical role thing there. If your hiring is going outside, that first hire has got to be right. I mean, you could really be signlined and your business will hurt. Everything is going to hurt if you don't make that first hire has to be the right one. Take your time with that. Without getting into specifics, tell tell can you share like how you keep her happy, reward her financially and otherwise, right? So I think that's like a personality profile type situation. So another cool Duncan thing is like I did like the personality profile on me. And I'm a you do the disc at the disc profile. Okay. Yep. So what you say you were going to say you're what? I'm a I'm a high D. I. Shocker. Yeah. Former former wrestler high D. Exactly right. Yeah. And she's a she's an S. She's an SC. So we compliment each other and which is great. So she. For her. Like the financial reward is is obviously important. Because we're all here to make money and make living. So really she I have found that she likes to be part of a team and she likes to win. And she likes to feel like she. The actions that she does directly impacts a positive result for our borrowers. So she gives a lot of fulfillment for that. So as she's kind of grown into the role, it's been really fun to see her grow. And for her to take on more things that she probably never thought that she would be doing. And being a little bit more. She's very. Introverted and trying to like she's pulling out of that. So it's cool to see her grow. And. And our relationship is really cool because she'll call me on my nonsense and be like, Hey, what are you doing today? I can see your schedule. You don't have any appointments. What? Why don't you have appointments? You need to be out there during the business. I'm doing it. I'm supposed to be doing. Why aren't you doing what you're supposed to be doing? All right. That's cool. That's very unique. I like that. You know, I'm glad you mentioned the disc for a moment because for anybody who's listening and looking at hiring, I'm a huge advocate of using a resource like the disc. There's a company that I'm a fan of. It's called Wiseire. There you go. Z-E-H-I-R-E. And they actually have a process where they'll help you find recruit. They'll place the job ad for you out on the various job sites for like a couple hundred bucks a month for whatever term you need. And they'll help you craft the messaging to attract that high S, that high C, whatever. Right. I mean, I use the disc a lot. Just to the point of like holding up here, you can see I've got my cheat sheet on the desk, right? Yep. Probably seeing something like that. Totally. I have this from a different company. Yeah, yeah. It has the different colors and what they don't mean. Right. Yeah. Yeah. But back to the point about your loan officer, you said she's a high S-C for those listeners who aren't as familiar with the disc. I mean, the values of somebody's doing high S-C, their basic motivation is security, appreciation, assurance. Right. Let me look on the back, backside or the other side here, C, basic motivation, excellence, value, they like. Now, this is relevant because we're talking about hiring an assistant. This is why using it to like the disc will help you identify the right person because you can get into the type of environment they want. They want to work in the how they respond best to a leader. Right. Needs how to communicate and blind spots and all that stuff. Totally. No, and it's so funny because when you read, you get like a pretty detailed report. I have mine here somewhere. Yeah. You want to be like a 15 page report. If you read through it and you really are open to it, you're like, yeah, that's totally me. When you're talking about the difficulties that you have and you're like you said you're blind spots. If you're honest with yourself and you read that, it's like, yeah, nailed it. It's totally true. And I gave that to her. I'm like, here, this is how this is how I am. And I want to understand how you are so that we can meet each other's needs and each other in business. I mean, it's a good exercise. First of all, self-awareness is key for yourself just in general in your life. If you're involved in your relationship with anybody, spouse, kids, and all that kind of stuff. It helps to understand their personality traits. And one last reference I'll give to everybody is Tony Robbins actually has a disc profile on his website. It's Tony Robbins.com forward slash disc. I've used this in the past as well. It's free. Just know that you're probably going to get some type of an offer after completing this thing. Tony Robbins, of course, you're going to get an offer. All right. So just be aware of that. But if you guys want to mess around with the disc profile, check your own out, you know, anybody else that you work with, that'd be a smart move for you. All right. So your main source then of business is real estate agents, right? I think it is for everyone, isn't it? No, so I think I was doing this again, the kind of coaching planning, right? So this year, probably about 60% realtor referrals, 20% past clients. And then the other 20% is going to hodgepodge. I have a couple of attorneys that send me their complicated, you know, divorced stuff and type of thing, which is fun. It's good to figure out. But I'm really looking at the future and trying to move the needle on some of those items. I kind of don't like the idea of having heavy concentrations. I think realtor referrals are never going to go away. But I think that for me, for the future, I want to have a more diverse sources of referrals, probably, you know, in 20% increments. If I had 20% realtor referrals, you know, 20% past clients, 20% maybe like CPAs or financial advisors, something to that extent where you're getting a wider range of referrals so that when the market changes and it will, that you kind of have all your basis covered, that you don't have a low in your business. Huh. Here's a question. Just popped in my head. No preparation. What are the activities that you enjoy doing that lead the business? I like people. So, you know, the thing that I have found is when I allow myself to be authentic and vulnerable with people, that it attracts them to you. And I find that to be true in personal life and in business. And when I meet with a client or get a referral from someone or try to prospect a new referral partner, we don't really talk about business because they already know what I'm there for. When I go and I have that meeting, it's really about who are you as a person? Are we a model match? Are we going to like doing business with each other? And just really to lay it all out online and just be like, this is who I am. This is what I'm all about. And, you know, some people are going to like that. And other people were going to shy away from it. And that's okay. Yeah. So, I'm not sure if that really answered your question. I can be more specific, I guess. I don't know. I mean, let me ask you another follow-up question to that. Then how do you primarily, let's take realtors, for example, how do you primarily get in front of them? Yeah. So, most of the realtors I work with, I've done a transaction with. Meaning, so they have the listing side and we have a real specific strategy on how I communicate with the listing agent on a deal that I have the buyer. And I'll tell them up front. If it's someone, like I'll kind of do my background, check on them to see who they are and make sure that they're someone I want to be in business with. And if they are, then I'll tell them up front, like I'm going to knock this out of the park. You're going to be blown away from your side of the transaction. And at the end, I'm going to ask you, if I've done enough for me to be considered as a potential partner for your buyer. So, that's cool. You asked that up front on the intro. Yeah. I tell them up front. As soon as we're in contract, I'll tell them. I'll do my background and make sure that they're the right kind of person. Yeah. Right. If they are, then I'm pretty aggressive. And then we'll tell them straight up, like I know who you are. And like, you know, I want to be your partner. So it sounds like straight out of a taken with Liam Neeson. I know who you are. Exactly. I have a special set of skills. Well, and then it's really that follow up to make sure that they feel the love. You know, that they that I'm doing something different than everyone else out here. So look, it's a very much overlooked area for you adding. Well, let me ask you this. How often do you get the the listing agents? Because that's great. Dan, I'm a listing agent. I get that sometimes. And I go, that's cool. And then, you know, I then. I guess my feeling is that there's enough business to go around. Yeah. You know, whatever. That's cool. Yeah. That's great. Then we're not fit. Then that's, you know, they're going to brush me off. That's cool. And that's the other day that I. This realtor like referred me a deal kind of out of the blue, right? And so I was like, cool. This is great. And this was like maybe six months ago. And I followed up with them. At the end of this year, it's like, hey, thanks so much for that referral. Nothing everyone I'm happening with it. We just want to say thanks. And you know what? If if we can get together and strategize for 2020 and see how I can be a partner to you and so on and so forth. That'd be really great. And she just fired back with this text message that was like, stop soliciting me. I'm not interested in working with you. I already have a lender. I was just like, like she was pretty aggressive with it. And I messaged her back. I was like, okay, like that's we're cool. You just sent me something earlier this year. And I just wanted to make sure that I was following up with you. And she just totally ghosted me. And for a second, I was like, oh man, that really hurts. Like that. I was like, I thought that we had something good going on here. And then I was like, you know what? We're just not a model match. And that's not someone I want to be in business with anyway. So that's cool. And this was a realtor who sent you a deal. Yeah. It was it was the most bizarre. It was the most bizarre thing. But is what it is. Things like a lot of psychological issues there. Yeah, I'm like, okay, that's cool. So. All right. In prepping for this interview, I also looked at. I look for things that kind of stand out for me. So you've got a fair amount of. Zilla reviews, right? 22. At this, at this time. And I'm always curious about like, are you consciously. Are you asking going for reviews? Yeah. I do. And kind of our process at the end of a transaction. I'll ask them to review. I have been a little sporadic. And where I ask people to review as things change and algorithms. And that sort of thing. So for a while, it was like, go to Yelp, you know. Yelp was going to be great. And then so that kind of stopped doing that a while back. And then it was the. Zillow firm in it. And then. Actually, I think it was your podcast. The guy from like reach 150 was on or something like that. Forever ago. And I was like, that sounds pretty cool. So I had some people go into there to leave some reviews. And now it's kind of like. Facebook. Google. Reach 150 kind of wherever someone wants to leave a review. I'll take it. And you send out like a post closing email for that. I do. Yeah. Thanks for your business. And. And you know, call army with questions. Here's the next time you're going to hear from me. Is if and when your loan gets transferred for servicing, make sure you have, you know, payment details on that guy. And then. If you have a minute, if you enjoyed our service, you know, leave me a review and helps my business grow. That type of that type of message. And how do you find the adoption on that pretty good? People leaving reviews. Pretty good. Probably. Half of them. Mm hmm. Somewhere at the leave review. Okay. All right. Very cool. Let's close out here with 2020, man. What are your plans for 2020? Anything you're implementing differently in your business, whether it's marketing or process wise. Yeah, I think I think it's just like I said, just trying to diversify the referral base. I think it's really honing in and learning, continuing to learn from on our process and. Continuing to develop our customer experience process and then creating templates around pretty much everything. I'm a big template person. I like maybe I'm old school, but I like paper templates where you actually have to write something down. And there's like a checklist of things to make sure that there's nothing missed. And as you get busier and busier, at least I have experience. Things get fuzzy and you forget details about things and having that checklist is pretty crucial. So every process that we have, we're creating templates for. It should be a predictable process, but still with some personality and individuality behind it. I don't want to be a machine where no one feels like they're getting. You know, cater to specifically. It's like, this is the way that we do it. You either fit it or you don't. Don't really like that. Kind of like to adapt to people as we go through the process. But in general, have a framework of how we do things. Right. And that's the big thing. It's just continuing the momentum that we have. And. I don't say perfecting because it's not really possible, but really. Yeah, optimizing as best we can the way that we. The way that we interact with the clients. I mean, it's everything from when you get a referral from somebody. What does that feel like? What does that look like? I've had this kind of pet peeve of like, oh, text my guy, Dan. Here's my phone number. I don't do that converts really well. So I'm working on a solution. I'll send it to you when I have it implemented. I'm working on a solution to make that experience better and different. So everything just working on the tiny little detail tweaks that I think will make a big difference in the production and satisfaction. Yeah. And also real quick. You mentioned you're already looking at hiring another person. Yeah. So. I think that. I kind of want to reduce part of the process and learning a little bit. I want to do redo part of the process. So my assistant is really, really good. And I want her to take on more of like the processing kind of director of operations type role. And the second person will do more kind of proactive annual review type things. I got like the total cost analysis type things where you can do an annual review and put something together and brand it and do that sort of thing. I don't have the time of the day to do it. They'll help me with some of my marketing outreach. They'll kind of be a catch all. First director of first impression type of person. Oh, nice. Yeah. Yeah. All the way down to stuffing envelopes and sending out mailers and. You know, it's it's going to be on the business side on the business side. Yep. Very nice. Very cool. No, I appreciate the details. That's very good. Awesome. So if anybody wants to reach out to you, man, what was the best place to reach to send them? Facebook, your website, what do you want to do? Yeah, just go to Instagram or Facebook and find me. Dan and Cheta. I think it's Dan and Cheta underscore home loans on Instagram. I'll put links in there too. Yeah. And I'm like open book. So if anyone wants to chat, I'll give you my cell number. Find me on LinkedIn has all my contact info there. And I'm happy to talk with whoever and. Yeah. Do it. Do it. Do it again to help everyone. Nice, man. Look, I mean, it's again, back to congratulations to you for the fast-track to success, right? Just three years in the biz, 80 plus units and, you know, you're going to grow even more in 2020. And you got smart and realize that in order for you to scale and grow, right? You had to have help and have an assistant. And so I think you did that earlier than most people do, man. So thanks. Yeah. And this whole thing just kind of stumbled into it to be honest with you. I still feel like I'm. I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm just kind of figured as I go and. Appreciate, you know, you reach out and. And that's getting together. Yeah, for sure. I wanted to. The whole point of this interview was to just kind of bring people into the discussion about hiring your first assistant. Getting over the hump to do that. There's a number of L.O.'s I'm working with right now that are actually in process to do that. You know, that that's the way you're going to grow because that's like you alluded to earlier on that roller coaster ride of. Of originate process, originate process. That cannot continue if you're ever going to really, you know, have a real business. Exactly. And I, yeah, I think that was the moment for me. I was like, I got it. I got to do this differently. And. Yeah. And then I just shut my mouth and listen to other smart people who who had done it and just did what they said to do. Well, look, man, I appreciate you making time. And listen, as always, thank you for tuning in and you know what to do. Hey, if you like this episode or others, leave us a review. And we will see you on the next one. Thanks for listening to Mortgage Marketing Radio. One more truth in mortgage marketing. Get more free training and resources at MortgageMarketingInstitute.com. Hey, guys, what's up real quick? You've heard about the Mortgage Marketing Pro membership before. And I just want to quickly remind you of that you're in a place in your business where you simply need more purchased loans. You need to fill your pipeline with purchase business. Let's just face it, agents are still a solid pillar of business and sources of purchase business for you. Well, good news. 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