Ep #87: How to Build an Audience and Grow Your Agent Referrals by Teaching Agent Classes

In today's highly competitive mortgage industry, building profitable relationships with the real estate agents is essential for success. However, finding effective ways to secure agent relationships can be a challenge. With so many mortgage loan originators vying for the attention of real estate agents, it can be difficult to stand out and establish meaningful connections. Our new case study featuring loan officer Chris Cogill is a must-read. Chris has closed a remarkable 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals. And in this case study, he shares his proven strategies for building strong relationships with real estate agents and leveraging those relationships to drive more business. To get your hands on this resource, head over to LOKestudy.com and download your free copy of the case study today. You'll find actionable insights and practical tips that Chris used to close 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals and how you can too. Don't miss out. Go check it out right now, visit LOKestudy.com and download your free copy today. 4-Kage Marketing Radio Brought to you by the Mortgage Marketing Institute, your number one source for truth in mortgage marketing. 3-Listening Jeff Zimper, thanks for tuning in to this episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio. So glad you're here. Hey, got a question for you. Are you looking to have better success with real estate agents or are looking to get more agent referrals, grow your business, make more money? Are you looking for a more effective, efficient, proven way to get in front of maximum agents in minimum time? If you're going to succeed in today's market, there's three things that I believe that you need. And those are our number one leads in referrals and let's face it, the number one source for purchase loans is still real estate agents. Agents are what I call oil wells. They can become a solid base of a consistent, predictable, stable, referral-based mortgage origination business. If you go about it the right way, if you have the right mindset, if you're intelligent about it, and if you apply the law of large numbers to your business. And then secondly, in today's world, we need systems and processes, proven processes because loan officers who wing it are dying breed. Today, what's it about demonstrating visible value with proven systems, scripting, and sales processes to deliver a five-star client and referral partner experience? What is your visible value? How good are you at articulating the conversation and have advice versus price conversations? Converting prospects and leads to actual clients, building that trust, that rapport, taking people off the street as they say in winning more deals, which ties into the third thing you need to succeed in today's market is a personal brand. Today, people are seeking incredible authority they can trust. Referral partners and buyers, clients, they're looking for a credible authority they can trust. And if you want to capture consumer direct business, here's what you need. You need to establish yourself with an online professional presence that's largely centered around content, providing value, and educating your marketplace because in this new customer journey, people are going to be engaging with you, usually quite a bit in advance before they actually want to engage you for your services. So, leasing referrals, systems, and processes, and a personal brand. And if you're looking for a resource to do that, I want to tell you this episode today is brought to you by Mortgage Marketing Institute Pro membership. Everything you need to get maximum agent referrals, build your online brand, and capture consumer direct business. If you want to check out that, learn more, go over to mortgagedmarketing.pro. That's mortgagedmarketing.pro, go there, learn more about what that is all about. And I'd love to have you in the membership, help you increase your sales, get more agent business, and consumer direct referrals, dive in, check out everything that's included in there. Now, it's relevant for today, and my special guest, Wade Vanderbohen, Wade, just become a great friend and person over the years. He was actually the very first guest I had on this podcast back in 2016. So, I'm grateful to him for that, and it's an update. We catch up to see what's going on, what's new and different in his business, and what I find out from Wade is that he's done a great job building his own personal brand in his local market of Washington, DC, Virginia area, and by the way, Wade is a title professional. That's right. He works for Stewart Title, and you can find links to his websites and YouTube channel on the show notes that I'll put in there, but he's affectionately referred to as the DC title guy, and has continued to grow his business every single year since we spoke back in 2016, and he's really kind of doubled down on his YouTube strategy, so you can go ahead and Google or YouTube search for Wade Vanderbohen, again, links in the show notes, but he's done a great job in building an online presence, a brand, and he leverages his education to deliver value and become essentially a coach for real estate agents, and a coach in the areas of how he can help them grow their business, have a positive impact, and have value so that he doesn't get stuck in the box of the commodity of, hey, a title rep, what's your price, what makes you different stuff that we've all heard before, right? So I asked Wade this question, you'll hear him answer the question about his number one source of business. He said teaching agent classes, and as I said, if you're looking for a great resource done for you, turnkey, library, every single month of a new agent class, go check out mortgagemarketing.pro, learn more over there. So that said, let's get into this week's show with my very special guest, Wade Vanderbohen. Hey, Wade, welcome to the show. Hey, glad to be here, thanks for having me. It's glad to be back. It is. Glad to be back. Yeah. Well, I have to give you a shout out, man. I was just looking this up. You were my very first guest on this podcast episode, and this is like incredible. I'm looking at the date that this thing was posted January 21st, 2016, damn, I do remember that. Yeah. I do remember that. Yeah. It's been a while. You've had a lot happen. Congratulations. You, uh, since we did that podcast, you're a father. How old is your daughter now? She turned two at the end of May. So yeah, she's up and running and a handful, I'm sure, but a good handful. Yeah, just something else to manage in your life, right? Yes. Yes, of course. A good thing. All right. So listen, let's get into it for the listeners. Um, uh, I had you back because you and I obviously have stayed in touch. And, uh, as those that are listening, you heard in the official intro, Wade is a known as the DC title guy, right, uh, title rep extraordinaire out of what Washington, DC, Virginia area. Is that right? Yeah. Northern Virginia, Washington, D.T. Yep. Right. And so, um, when I had you on the podcast originally, like back then in 2016, it's because you were one of the few, uh, dare I call you affiliates, right? Not a realtor, but an affiliate title. That's grow, you know, all that jazz wonders. Right. Um, that was really doing a great job building a brand using video, social media, your teachin' a lot of classes. And geez, I got to assume that hasn't been workin' for you at all. Hahaha. It's been workin' really well. Uh, it's, you know, I, I will get into this, but, you know, video and websites and learning how to create effective content that the one would look for when they have a need is, uh, the ultimate leveraging tool in your business. That's for sure. Yeah. So I wanted to unpack a couple of things, um, you know, I jokingly say that hasn't been workin' for you because I think two years ago, right, the loan officers in particular, mostly my audience were scratching their head, going, well, you know, I don't know, this like online thing, video, the thing, your brand, um, I still don't see a ton of adoption with loan officers specifically using video to build their brand. And then let's tie it into what you said to me a couple of weeks ago over Facebook was the phrase buildin' audience. So I want to ask you, why do you think it's relevant as, you know, a title, uh, professional lender to build an audience today? Well, I think, you know, you have to build an audience because you have to remain relevant, right? And so if you're a title rep, I mean, uh, any, any high producing lender or high producing realtor, they get beat up all day by title people calling them and realtor's get beat up by lenders calling them, want to take them to coffee and lunch and all this stuff. And, you know, in those situations, to the realtor at that point, you're just a vanilla person, right? You're just another lender, another title person. So if you learn how to develop an audience, well, an engaged audience, that, that means they're coming back because you've now are posting or creating content or information that makes them smarter because you're offering something that they, maybe they didn't know, you're teaching them something, or you're constantly, you are, you are where their eyeballs are looking. So if they're, if they're on your website, if they're, you're getting them and driving traffic to a YouTube video, I mean, these, these videos have the ability to, you know, they last forever, unless you take them down. So if you can get people to subscribe to your channel, come back and visit it because you now you posted something really great and now they're waiting for the next great thing that's coming, you know, just like if you subscribe to a magazine or you have a show that's on every week, like Game of Thrones, right? Oh my God, I can't wait to see what happens next week. It's, it's very similar. So if you can create an interested audience, it's what is the greatest way to differentiate yourself. And as a load officer or a title person, if you are going after a high producing realtor and you want to earn their business, you got to show them that you have this value problem. So if you can push them or get them to the place where you've created all this great content, it helps lower the barrier of resistance. It helps them get to know you better before you ever even meet the person and they might even start liking you right away. So all of a sudden when you meet with them, it helps convert them over to a yes. Hey, I'll give you a shot at my next buyer, I'll give you a next contract or whatever that is. So growing an audience and sustaining that audience is important because again, if it's on a medium like a YouTube where videos live forever and there's, you know, they can be, they can be searched and found. And again, you're growing subscribers. You could be on vacation. You could be doing something with your family and you're always going to have people watching your videos. That's a great leveraging tool. That's good stuff. Thank you. How has you now building this presence in brand online on YouTube, specifically, right? It's kind of where you've gone all in. If I'm looking at the stats, you have approximately 150 videos. Is that right? Roughly. Yep. Yep. So you've been doing it for some time. How has that changed? By the way, for those listening, I'll put links to your Wade's YouTube channel on the show notes, his website, all that stuff. So you can see the great content he's got. But how has that, you know, the presence you've got, the brand you've established, the content strategy, how has that changed, either how you approach agents to get their business or how they may have come to you? Okay. That's good. So two things, how I approach agents is, you know, I always tell them that the reason why I'm talking to them about these things is because I, I also do them and I know the results that I've achieved from it. So, you know, agents are always like, oh, how do I get more listings or how do I get more buyers or how do I break into a farm or how do I do, well, you know, you have to be where people are looking. So, you know, for me, I kind of shoot videos about things that my clients ask me questions about or just helpful marketing tips in general. I don't, you get on my YouTube channel, most of my stuff is not about title insurance. Some of it is, but a lot of it's not. You know, it's about marketing things that my, my customers and my clients want to know about, you know, Army strategies, online marketing strategies, how to index, how to get your videos indexed in YouTube and in Google searches and things like that. So since I have a platform of, hey, this is my experience, I actually do it. It allows them to say, listen, I'm getting, I want to get interested in doing videos or I want to get, or I want to have a YouTube channel. I just don't have anyone to help me, but I see that you're doing it. So can you come and help me? So it allows me to get a lot of appointments very easily because I can say here for reference, check out my channel, see what I'm doing, keep in mind that at one point in time, I only had one video or I had two videos or my, my, my analytics was pretty crappy because I was new and didn't know what I was doing either, but now I do know what I'm doing. So I can help you do the same thing except I can, I can cut down your learning curve big times. So you know, what it does is it allows me to, when I'm outside prospecting, it allows me to score a point of easy. Secondly, it allows me to get a lot of inbound appointments. So like I'll have lender clients that will talk to an agent and say, hey, you should meet my title guy and by the way, you should check them out. But if you go over here, you can see what he's about and they, they, they help push people to my channel or I just get discovered by people searching in the search bar and then I get a lot of inbound calls, emails, leads, things like that. So it's twofold. You have, it makes the ability to prospect outward easier, a lot easier. And secondly, it allows you to get a lot of inbound stuff coming your way. So you know, it's like anything in our business that lowers the barrier of resistance for someone to say, I'll meet with you, I'll get, I'll go to lunch with you, I'll send you my next buyer, I'll send you my next deal because I see value in what you're doing. It makes things a lot easier when it becomes their idea versus you making them feel like you made it, you made them do something they weren't sure of they were doing. So then what's your primary source, you know, stream for you getting real estate agent appointments? One classes. So if you, you're on my website, DCTotterGuide.com, I have a real estate marketing classes tab. One of them is actually specifically for loan officers, one of my classes is called, how loan officers can effectively market their realtors because, you know, that, that, that seems to be the issue with the realtors that are struggling is they don't have to, to get the appointments or what to say in an appointment. But, you know, teaching classes, I'll have brokers now, you know, they ask me to come in and teach at the brokerage, real estate associations want me to come in and speak obviously to their, to their agents and do various classes because the classes I have are some of the offline marketing, some of it is online marketing, obviously social media based. So I kind of cover, I try to cover all three things, not just, it's only online marketing that's it. And if you're not about that, then forget you, I have farming stuff and how to generate listings and how to convert renters into buyers, things like that, but classes for sure. And then secondly, for the title people, it's definitely calling and emailing non-directing customers. So let's say you send me a deal today, the transaction, well, there's a listing agent on the other side of the deal, that's the non-directing customer. They have a transaction with their audience. I call those people when I can, I email them and I send them links on my website and YouTube channel and our marketing services and let them know, I can help you do all this stuff. I can help you get more exposure for your business. I can get more eyeballs to your website so that if more people know that you existed and how valuable you were as a realtor, you'd have more clients. And they say, yeah, I would, well, who's helping you from the title side from do that? No, nobody. Well, I will. And then that's how I get, that's how I get appointments. Wow, that's really cool. I mean, this sounds like a rhetorical question, but that's worked for you. That's been successful. It has. Yeah. So when I met with you, I talked to you in 2016, 2016 was my best year ever, 2017 was better than 2016 and I'm about 15%, 20% ahead this year as I was last year. Wow. That's awesome, man. But here's the caveat to that. Here's the caveat to that. Due to the content and the things that I've done online, the amount of hours I've put into working, even though I still work a lot, is less than what it was when I was in like 2014, 2015, really, really hustling, you know, to build, build, build, because now that I've created this whole thing online, a lot of it is, it just, it's like perpetual wheel. So it makes things, it makes things go smoother, the systems are in place. So always hustling, but it's a, it's a different type of hustle than what I was before. Yeah. It's like the metaphor I use is like, you know, getting the plane off the runway, you're going to burn a lot of fuel to get it off, but once you're up in the air, right, you just, you set your course and you're, you get your coordinates and then you just need to kind of, you know, check in and make sure you're on track. So you've built the entrance, speak, which are the classes and the online presence. And so you kind of, you know, do this thing called reverse prospecting where people are now coming to you. Yeah. And it's a lot more fun that way. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, right? I don't know anybody who loves cold calling. So if you're looking for, all right. Right. Go going. How many classes, what's the frequency of classes look like for you? I try to teach. Well, depends. Okay. So typically in spring market here, like it's extremely busy. So it's tough to get agents to come to stuff because they're just, they're just constantly ratifying contracts. Which is great. I do a lot of my classes, usually over, let's say July, August, because here, July, August, school's out, people go, you know, people are around. So you got one week somebody's on vacation the next week, they're back. So usually July, August, I do a lot of classes. And then I do classes definitely towards the end of the year because people are always looking to revamp their marketing, revamp their business. So I mean, most of the year I do classes, but probably the, you know, March, April, May, June, it's tough to really get people to come with that said. I mean, I'm always willing to, you know, do classes at like mortgage offices. They love it because they, you know, I can drive real through traffic to their office and they like that. And then usually in the fall, I'm usually speaking or teaching classes at like real through associations because they have their fall events and they want somebody to come in, you know, to, you know, talk about a specific topic that maybe they're not, they're not as familiar with them about online stuff. Yeah. And at this point, people are reaching out to you asking, hey, will you come teach this class? Yes. For the most part. Yeah. That's like 90% of it. Wow. That's great. And speaking of classes, you know, in that being the no more in-source of business for you about an agent that recently came your way because of a class you were teaching on YouTube. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. I was asked to come to a mortgage office to teach class on how to create a professional YouTube channel for real estate. They, most agents are looking to get into YouTube or do videos and don't know really how to get started or they have a channel and they don't realize all the back end stuff they got to be doing. So I taught a class and a realtor came. I didn't know her at all, but then I found out after the meeting that she is only been in the business like three years and she has already done 38 transactions this year alone. So she's probably on pace for like 45-50, which is fantastic. So I emailed her as a follow-up, she didn't respond, called her, got on the phone. She told me she was loyal to a different title company, which of course anybody who's doing business has some loyalty. So I spoke to her on the phone about what they were doing to help her business and she's basically said that she has a great processor, blah, blah, blah, no marketing help, so that of it. I quickly found out what her real wants and needs were was help with farming or subdivision. She needed help with her online presence. She wanted to get started shooting videos and she wanted to grow a YouTube presence in a YouTube audience. So she agreed to meet with me the next day. We spoke for over an hour. I went over all the things that she needed and told her how I can help her and what I could do. And that night, she sent me a follow-up email letting me know that she was ratifying a contract and she had already, she puts your title on it and she wanted to get sent it to us. Wow. Bam! There it is. So yeah, that's kind of the sales funnel, right? I mean, send out the blast email, offering something of value that maybe somebody doesn't know about very well the way I want to learn more. You get them interested. They come to the class, get them face-to-face, keep the class, show value, follow up, even if they don't respond to you, keep following up. And then even though I got it rebuttal immediately about why she couldn't work with me, I kept her on the phone, asking questions, got the answers to those questions, use those answers to let her know how I was different or could help her. She saw the value and what those answers agreed to meet, built rapport, followed up, send me a contact. Yeah. So there's one thing I wanted to highlight in there, it sounds like to me it broke from me from wrong. You didn't try and convince her with how great your company is and your process and your products. That's not what got her to the tables, right? No, yeah, definitely. No, I mean, I don't need with that. I mean, say in two or titles, national company is great, but that's not the end of stuff. My question to her was, what's your marketing goals, what are you trying to achieve? So the company you're currently using, you like the processor, that's fantastic, she's supposed to get to the closing of her job, but what else are they? So what happens? I asked her specifically, what happens when your transaction is closed? So in the meantime, when they close, do they just wait for you to send them another deal or do they call you and follow up and ask how they can help you generate more clients or give more eyeballs to your business? Did they do you? She's like, oh, yeah, they don't do anything like that. And I was like, well, that's what I do. So once I explained it in shoulder and talked for more in detail about the relationship we're looking for and how I can help her do that. And the fact that I don't cost her any money, I'm like a free resource for her business. She was like, okay, this makes total sense. Let's get together in person and let's talk. Yeah, it's the risk. So the no risk, no risk, and if you have somebody offering to help you put more money in your pocket by giving you information and helping you with things that you're not as good at, that'd be great. Like I just told you, I have landscapers coming over my house next week. I have a new house. I don't own equipment. I know how to do stuff, but I don't own anything and I don't, but I'm not a landscaper, right? I'll gladly have somebody come over and help me and do that. How involved are you? Okay, you have the meeting with her and you took a look at a big broad brush. Okay, here's what I want to do. She wants to do videos, YouTube, all that stuff. To what degree are you involved in helping her implement that? Okay, that's a good question. So as far as she wants, so for instance, if she wanted me to, if she wanted to give me her login credentials, I could set up her entire channel for her in terms of if she told me, hey, listen, these are the subdivisions that I'm targeting, these are the keywords I'm looking for. This is what I'm trying to do. I could set up, you know, for branding, for her videos, the tags, I told her to download. There's something called, there's a Chrome extension for YouTube called TubeBuddy, T-U-B-E-B-U-D-D-Y. I told her to download that and then you can create custom thumbnails, you can track your analytics better, you can, there's a lot, it does a far more than what just what YouTube offers. You know, I could set up the card feature for her by verifying the SEOs or website through Google Webmaster Tools. I have a little mini studio in my office. I said, if you want to come by my office and shoot videos on, you know, like for instance, what closing costs does a buyer pay a transaction, what does a seller typically pay? We could do that, so I'd be willing to either meet her at her office or my office issue videos. I also work with a couple professional videographer for some of my more higher-in stuff. Yes, that does cost the money, but it's well worth it in my opinion. I told her that I could create introductions for her and I would even go to the studio. And, you know, we could upload her scripts into like the teleprompter. I have a teleprompter app on my iPad and as far as she wanted me to take it, you know, for somebody who is younger, you know, growing their business or super hungry, they want to learn, you know, and they're in the business for the long haul. I mean, it's like, why wouldn't you go above and beyond to, you know, make that happen? Right. Well, obviously you've spent time investing in your own career and knowledge to learn how to do some of those things. Yes. Well, when I, you know, from a recap of our previous call, you know, when I moved to the DC or I didn't know anybody, you know, I moved here from Phoenix to had no clients. So, you know, I was already kind of getting involved in some of this stuff and learning and, you know, I, but I had to look at from a standpoint of what's the next thing that realtors and lenders need to know how to do to gain business and stay relevant. Right. It's not about OSU or titles the best. It's like what value as can I bring to the table that can get me the most appointments, have clients want to work with me, want to refer me and it came down to teaching and helping these people implement systems and learn things that they necessarily don't know how to do yet. You know, I'm curious. What, in terms of real estate agents, and I don't know if you could, this is just a weird question, okay, but can you assess, because I know you've made this offer, right, this proposal to a lot of real estate agents. Do you have a sense of the response, the positive response to that from agents, kind of like an, you know, I don't know if you can give them an average and like you said, it depends on the agent. So if they're old and crotchety on their way out, okay, not the right target. But, you know, any sense of, does that message, that offer, right, does that get responded to positively? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, here's the thing with agents, and you know, you can relate is that sometimes you give them everything and you help them with everything and you show them everything and they still don't do it, right, but, you know, the thing is, I look at, and I think my clients look at me as like the safety net on the trapeze act. Like if they ever fall, like, you know, that I'm there to save them, right, they need help with data mining, they need help with YouTube or shooting the video because they need handholding or they need, like, today I met with the team and they need me to look at the back end of their WordPress website because they had no idea how to use the SEO plug-ins or how to optimize their blog pages or the upload when they, you know, wrote a blog page about a listing, they did their, their permalinks were wrong and they weren't even putting them in better descriptions. So like I sat down with them for an hour and a half and showed them that by step what they have to do, fully optimize their blog posts and their pages on their website. So, you know, things that you would think, well, how is that a big deal? Well, it's a big deal when now you're on the first page of Google versus four, you know, and they're like, oh jeez, you know, now I'm getting more eyeballs to my business because peat in that, you know, it could just be one color, one email turns into a listing, that listing could turn into a buyer, you know, a sell buy and all of a sudden they made $20,000 right there. Cool. Right? Because two deals out of it. So, you know, it's that sort of thing. But I mean, yeah, I mean, my clients, you know, some of my clients use a lot of this stuff. Some of them don't use a lot of it, but they know that when the time is, when they're ready, they can come to me for it. So, you know, it's, it's, but it's the same time, it's also things are not getting anywhere else. They're not getting at that before. Yeah, they have a good attorney or a good processor or whatever, but they're not getting that support that they need to just stay relevant. Like I said, there's, you know, there's 87% fell rate real estate in the first five years. Why? Yeah. That's why. Yeah. And a note on the meta tags and all those wonderful things for people who have heard that, you obviously have gone deep on your education. I'm sure you would agree. People don't necessarily need to go there. If all you did was offer to help agents with video if that was their thing, right? I mean, you would get a lot more play, a lot more traction that way. Just find out what their thing is. Sure. Of course. It's the big takeaway. Yeah. Oh, 100%. 100%. I mean, it's funny. People like, well, where did you learn all this stuff? Like, do you have a, you know, a technology bet? I have a social work background. So, I don't have, I used to work for a teleprotective services in Phoenix before I even got, and I did loans for nine months and got into title this in back in 2005. So, but, you know, all the information that I learned is I started subscribing to other people's channels, started looking up information online, you know, and just doing the homework on my spare time to figure out how to do all this stuff or just how to learn, how to learn enough, or that I was at least smarter than the person I was talking to. Yeah. You know, and just real quickly, it reminds me of a conversation I had just earlier today with a top loan officer up in Pacific Northwest, he'll be on a future podcast, but I asked him this question, and this guy does, I forget, like 200 loans a year or something. But I asked him, you know, how he sees the role of a loan officer changing, this relates to a title rep as well, you've, you've blazed a trail here already, but he told me that here's the role he sees changing between loan officer and agent. Number one, you make that decision, are you relational, are you transactional? So, if you're transactional, you're in the wrong side of the business, go to a call center, whatever, that's how you're going to survive. If you're relational, then he sees the role changing for loan officers to become coaches for agents, adding value, impact, right, strategy, things like that, things that you talked about, which is, what are you trying to achieve? How are you trying to grow your business? What are your goals? Where's, where's the weak points? If you had a magic wand, right, what's one thing you would, and you're going to hear all this stuff, you're going to hear like, yeah, I'm not good at video, I'm this or that or the other, and then be that problem solver, right, with that, I was curious if you do, like you meet with that agent, right, you do the whole YouTube thing, hey, here's, here's I got this mini studio here, is there any type of continuity of, you know, engagement with her over, you know, a period of a month or two or whatever to help her really implement that stuff? Yeah, I mean, you have to have follow-up strategies, you know, otherwise it's like, oh, look, I had a really great touch with this agent, and you sent me one deal, now she's lying forever, it's like, you know, if you think that, that's an issue already, but I mean, you have to continue to have follow-up strategies, you know, so for instance, like she sends me the deal, right, well, you think her for that, you know, you want to follow up maybe during the transaction, follow up when it closes, you know, or just even call her just during the transaction and be like, hey, by the way, have you made any progress on shooting any videos? Do you need help with anything? You know, so it's just continually following up and following up and following, I mean, it is a loan officer or title person like you know, I mean, obviously it's important to follow up with everybody, but you know really, really, really follow up with, to keep them in there. Also, you know, I push out, I send out like a blog email every week to all of my clients, like a little paragraph of information that it's like a Q&A, like real estate, video question of the week, or you know, it could even be a legal question or a lending question. But things that I get from the people that I meet with and then I'm like, oh, I'll just then I answer it in the thing there. So it's a question and an answer. And then at the bottom, I'm like, hey, if you want to set up an appointment, you need help with these things, like call me, email me, let me know what days work best for you, you know, make sure you keep using this short title, blah, blah, blah, blah, right. So like, but I have something that goes out in front of them every week. I do a lot of Instagram stories, uh, post stuff on Facebook, you know, like I've always posted, I mean, just I try to post relevant stuff where their eyeballs are, right? And then of course, it's just, you know, following up with emails and calls to see what's going on, uh, and seeing how they're doing. So I realized that life comes into play and I was like, I listen, dude, I just didn't have time to get to it this week. Like my kid was sick and that happened and that happened like the time. But as long as you're following up and you're, you're still there and you're interested and you're still on top of it, I mean, that's, that's big. I mean, I have a low officer client, I'm not even lying, dude, he has a, he has a database in a roll of deck. I'm like, let her roll back. Yes, a little roll of deck. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Yeah, but he's always calling me, he's like, you should come teach a class in my office because he wants to go, he doesn't know how to get agents interested, right? So he needs someone to get him, who can get him interested. So he can like, you know, I got to put it on the T form, right? So yeah, that's, that's an issue on itself. But yeah, yeah, I mean, it, well, real quick, how about your blog? What I like about your blog, the, you know, the communication you send out to these agents and others weekly is, um, it's, it's, first of all, it's you, right? If I'm following this correctly, it's you're doing a video, like you said, and there's relevant content in there. It's not that the corporate cookie cutter stuff that's mostly useless. Right. No. No offense. Two corporates. Nope. I work for one, but no, you got to make it personal because it's got to be you. You got to get people to, again, you know, people work with people know they know like interest, right? Yeah. So you got to, you got to get them there as well. It's got to be personal. But I want to also preface to say that when I'm shooting a lot of my videos, which you are on my YouTube channel, you can see it. I have some professional stuff, but most of my stuff is not professionally done. It's done with, you know, a nice high-end camera and some lighting equipment. But I'm in my office most of the time shooting these videos. So I don't want people to think that if you want to shoot YouTube videos or get involved, it's got to be like, okay, I got to go spend $5,000 on a camera equipment and learn the most crazy stuff about photography or camera or video. You don't, you don't need to do that. Right. No. I mean, you, yeah, you're in your office. I can see it. You get your title, store title, um, you know, sign behind you. You get that it's not raining at the same time, buying those brain cells. That's awesome. Yeah. Uh, any other big projects you're working on in terms of, you know, content and education, things like that? Uh, well, I'm speaking at an event coming up in October, uh, called Ops Box Retreat. So for Kelaweins, they, uh, there's a really big hitter here. Her name is Christy Bell Grossman. She's on the Bell team. They do over $100 million in volume a year. But she, she does a lot of stuff with the operations people within Kelaweins nationally. He goes around a lot of public speaking while she's doing a big event on, uh, in October, and it's going to be in northern Virginia. A lot of people are flying in and, uh, I'm just happy I get to speak. Well, 15 minutes. But I get to speak in front of like the top operations people of all Kelaweins for 15 minutes of a stage. Uh, yeah. It's going to be cool. And so, and then I'm also speaking at, uh, another association event for realtors, uh, in early October as well in teaching a class called, I just got my real estate license. Now what do I do? There's actually one of my more favorite classes at the beach because I mean, these agents are new and they're just looking at you like, like, it's the first day of school. Like, let's, what do I do? And, uh, it's a really fun one. But, um, I'm trying to develop some more classes, but I just need to find a time to sit down and really knock out a couple more things. There's definitely some more opportunities. Uh, I think there's got to be a whole class on Instagram. It evolved so much and it's such a place now where people are spending their time and growing. You've got to be a class on that, but I got to get together. No doubt. All right. That's awesome. Uh, cool, man. Well, listen, I know you're busy. You got so much going on at the house, at the home. And, uh, once again, congratulations on, uh, you know, as we shared before we hit record, it's going to be father again real soon. Yeah. So, yeah. Man. Yep. Love it. Love it. Love it. So, best to you, man. I hope to, like, you know, hook up with you in person at some time in the near future. I just want to thank you for, right, continuing to share as always. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You know, I mean, why reinvent the wheel? He's doing some great things and it's obviously working for him. So, listeners, I appreciate you tuning in on this one if you like it. Please let us know. Leave us a review on iTunes or whatever else you're listening. And I'll see you on the next one. Bye for now. Thanks for listening to Mortgage Marketing Radio. One more truth in Mortgage Marketing. Get more free training and resources at MortgageMarketingInstitute.com. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hey, guys. What's up real quick? You've heard about the Mortgage Marketing Pro membership before. And I just want to quickly remind you of that. 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